Alan Preston v Richard Gordon NHC

[Nakedmanoncrack]

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What is the definition of bigness?

Nottm Forest won two European cups? Are they bigger clubs than Arsenal or Chelsea or even Everton for that matter?

Wimbledon won an FA cup. Are they bigger than anyone at all?

Is a big club one with a traditionally large fan base, irrespective of how many trophies they have won? Are Rangers and Celtic really as big as they claim to be, bearing in mind they play in a predominately weak league set up? (Ignoring the fact that their support is drawn from non-geographical base).

If the Scottish clubs had been integrated within a British league set up would anyone here in Scotland even consider referring to any Scottish club as big? Even the halfwits at the other side of town couldn't come out with that nonsense.

So many questions so few answers.

I doubt anyone could come up with a definitive objective, rather than subjective, test.

I see both Hearts and Hibs as bigger than Aberdeen, though Aberdeen are clearly more successful in terms of trophys won.

[Captain Trips]

The term" ya couple of fannies" springs to mind.

[Bostonhibby]

Aberdeen fans probably want to be "big" and probably spend a bit of time thinking about it.

Yams fans have to be "big" because of their misguided belief that sometime somewhere they were "big" and there's been pressure to maintain that belief since at least when Mercer was trying to expand them into something "big" with other peoples money in the form of bank loans way back then.

[J-C]

Just having a Look at Aberdeen on Wiki and the thing I do notice that they had a wee bit of success in the 30's and the 50's but it wasn't until the investment from the oil industry into the club in the late 70's that the majority of their success started, take out the oil money and they wouldn't have the successful history they have had.

[Stokesy's on fire]

Richard Gordon is a joke his comments are typical of the deluded sheep. Aberdeen FC are a bang average club and as for Preston...

[neil7908]

Bald men arguing over a comb.

Now there is some distance between us winning the cup I've been thinking a lot about Scottish football and I'm more sure than ever that we need to get rid of Rantic.

Look at how our support has picked up when they have a chance to see us winning trophies and competing for league titles.

We sold out the home end of ER for a mid season game in the Scottish second tier against Dundee United FFS!

Can you imagine the clamour for tickets if we were facing Hearts or Aberdeen at home in a game to decide the SPL title?

Football fans talk about loyalty a lot but the truth is winning teams attract more fans. That's why Scottish football is dying in its current form, big clubs like Hibs, the Dons and Hearts will only ever be able to achieve a modicum of success domestically before the ugly sisters reassert themselves.

A truly competitive league is a must for Scotland to grow both domestically and internationally.

[Deansy]

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Aberdeen no matter what anyone thinks. I'm also pretty sure they've never been out of the top league.... The team at the top are no more though

Rank	Club	League	SC	LC	UCL	UEL	CWC	USC	Total	Last Trophy
1	Rangers	54	33	27	0	0	1	0	115	2010–11 Scottish Premier League
2	Celtic	47	36	16	1	0	0	0	100	2016–17 Scottish League Cup
3	Aberdeen	4	7	6	0	0	1	1	19	2013–14 Scottish League Cup
4	Heart of Midlothian	4	8	4	0	0	0	0	16	2011–12 Scottish Cup
5	Hibernian	4	3	3	0	0	0	0	10	2015–16 Scottish Cup
5	Queen's Park	0	10	0	0	0	0	0	10	1892–93 Scottish Cup

No.4 should have * next to it marked as 'Subject to change once Romanov's caught - also possible Mercer and Robinson's time of ownerships may be investigated because if one's been naughty .....................'

[O'Rourke3]

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No.4 should have * next to it marked as 'Subject to change once Romanov's caught - also possible Mercer and Robinson's time of ownerships may be investigated because if one's been naughty .....................'

Indeed....

[sauzeelegod]

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Bald men arguing over a comb.

Now there is some distance between us winning the cup I've been thinking a lot about Scottish football and I'm more sure than ever that we need to get rid of Rantic.

Look at how our support has picked up when they have a chance to see us winning trophies and competing for league titles.

We sold out the home end of ER for a mid season game in the Scottish second tier against Dundee United FFS!

Can you imagine the clamour for tickets if we were facing Hearts or Aberdeen at home in a game to decide the SPL title?

Football fans talk about loyalty a lot but the truth is winning teams attract more fans. That's why Scottish football is dying in its current form, big clubs like Hibs, the Dons and Hearts will only ever be able to achieve a modicum of success domestically before the ugly sisters reassert themselves.

A truly competitive league is a must for Scotland to grow both domestically and internationally.

Totally agree

[Jim44]

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Not trying to be smart but I don't think English is paco's first language.

That being the case, I apologise to paco. I don't make a habit of picking up on weak English or mocking it but my response was a spontaneous reaction to Hoboharry's post.

[Super_JMcGinn]

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What a daft argument, all 3 clubs are very similar, and all 3 at any particular time could pull in more folk through the gates than the other.

Aberdeen have certainly won most, and i personally would have loved it if we'd done what they did in the 80's.

Those days are over for them, and its something thats never returning. If all 3 clubs are fighting for 2nd place in the SPL or whatever its called these days, we are all getting similar crowds with very little between us.

In terms of trophies won the dons shade it from our neebors.

In terms of fan base, historically our neebors win that argument hands down, mainly due to their catchment area and I would say we were ahead of the dons on that score.

If all 3 were challenging we would only get the same crowds because of stadium capacity as it is.

If we had done what they did in the 80's we would be playing in a 30000 all seated stadium long ago.

If romance style and history were a factor we would win hands down.

[tamig]

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That being the case, I apologise to paco. I don't make a habit of picking up on weak English or mocking it but my response was a spontaneous reaction to Hoboharry's post.

No probs Jim.

[Carheenlea]

As an aside, I was catching up today on the Sportsound podcast from Friday night's game, and instead of Richard Gordon, the host was Geoff Webster. His style is quite old school, but a refreshing change from Richard Gordon, and one I'd like to be seen given more airtime when covering live events. Pundits were Tam McManus and Ryan McGowan, with McGowan in particular surprising me by coming across as a likeable guy (for a former Hearts player). Both spoke well on the match without any theatrics, and with Tom English contributing with interesting analysis, the BBC proved they can put out very good radio coverage of football when they have the headphones on the better broadcasters.
The guys like Alan Preston need to be put out to pasture if the quality of the programme is to improve on a more consistent basis.

[Galahibby]

I didn't realise Preston was Yogi's cousin til they mentioned it on Off the Ball on Saturday. Who knew?! (that was rhetorical - I'm assuming everyone but me knew 😏)

[JimBHibees]

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I didn't realise Preston was Yogi's cousin til they mentioned it on Off the Ball on Saturday. Who knew?! (that was rhetorical - I'm assuming everyone but me knew 😏)

One Rangers fan one Celtic fan apparently.

[SouthsideHarp_Bhoy]

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I didn't realise Preston was Yogi's cousin til they mentioned it on Off the Ball on Saturday. Who knew?! (that was rhetorical - I'm assuming everyone but me knew 😏)

I always thought they were brothers-in-law?

So i didnt know either!

[SouthsideHarp_Bhoy]

Ive always thought, us the dons and the hearts are much of a muchness, with factors at play at the time affecting who is on top. I wouldnt claim any is bigger than the other historically.

The dons are the most successfull though, two european trophies trumps a lot i would say, a feat that will never be repeated bu us or hearts.

On europe, i think hearts lag way behind both us amd the dons.

Leavue titles are the same, although hearts have won the fewest in 'modern' times i think.

Cups we are obviously miles behind, but cup finals we are about equal, and recent times we knock the socks off of both in cups.

Dunno about crowds, but hibs have higher record crowd by some distance of the three, and are only one to average over 30k in a season (i think).

[northstandhibby]

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Ive always thought, us the dons and the hearts are much of a muchness, with factors at play at the time affecting who is on top. I wouldnt claim any is bigger than the other historically.

The dons are the most successfull though, two european trophies trumps a lot i would say, a feat that will never be repeated bu us or hearts.

On europe, i think hearts lag way behind both us amd the dons.

Leavue titles are the same, although hearts have won the fewest in 'modern' times i think.

Cups we are obviously miles behind, but cup finals we are about equal, and recent times we knock the socks off of both in cups.

Dunno about crowds, but hibs have higher record crowd by some distance of the three, and are only one to average over 30k in a season (i think).

Excellent post bud. Got me thinking of our own past european exploits. The dons were very lucky indeed to acquire a fantastic team in the early eighties which is when they achieved their european glory.

However it was our club that was at the forefront of the european adventures in the very early fifties as you will very probably know already.

We were invited to participate as the first british club to play in the european cup in 1955/56 because of our prestige at that time. We went on to compete to the semi final stage which is a monumental achievement for our club and was a proud moment for Scottish Football.

We since went on to have a number of memorable results on our european journeys beating Barcelona and Napoli and many other notable victories.

So I would say there is possibly a case for our club having the better overall european history than the dons and of course the Yams because of our many adventures and the prestige of being the first ever british club to participate in the european cup.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/scotland/sports...43/print.shtml

A decent article by the BBC on the earlier history of scottish clubs in europe.

Glory Glory

[ancient hibee]

It was undoubtedly an accolade to be invited to take part in the first European Cup but I don't think winning two ties to get into the semi final can really be considered as being ahead of Aberdeen's achievements.

[northstandhibby]

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It was undoubtedly an accolade to be invited to take part in the first European Cup but I don't think winning two ties to get into the semi final can really be considered as being ahead of Aberdeen's achievements.

Tbf to myself I did say our overall european adventures and notable victories and not just the two ties to get to the semi-final.

Aberdeen's achievements were done by more luck of having one gifted set of footballers set against our many years of participation.

Albeit it was a marvelous achievement by that dons team for sure.

Glory Glory

[O'Rourke3]

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Aberdeen's achievements were done by more luck of having one gifted set of footballers set against our many years of participation.

More to do with the gifted manager and the Club Chairman no? That team didn't just happen by chance. I agree with the point though :

[ancient hibee]

You did but to be honest I don't feel that great games but eventual losses are the same as winning.I thought after beating Barcelona we had a great chance although it was by no means one of our best teams but we were let down by the board over the third Roma game.Where Abe deen benefitted was in having a succession of good managers who built the team up over a number of years.

[northstandhibby]

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More to do with the gifted manager and the Club Chairman no? That team didn't just happen by chance. I agree with the point though :

When you put it like that I probably could have worded it a bit better.

[jabis]

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10...5...whatever

Aberdeen have won what...2 league cups in 25 years? Add a terrible average finish in the league along with attendances that were below both Hibs and Hearts for a period and an incredible winless record at Hampden and I think you have a draw.

No way can anyway say Aberdeen are a bigger club than Hearts...or Hibs for that matter

I'm calling a draw

🎶and if you know your history...

[northstandhibby]

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You did but to be honest I don't feel that great games but eventual losses are the same as winning.I thought after beating Barcelona we had a great chance although it was by no means one of our best teams but we were let down by the board over the third Roma game.Where Abe deen benefitted was in having a succession of good managers who built the team up over a number of years.

Fair do's ancient.

[SouthsideHarp_Bhoy]

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Excellent post bud. Got me thinking of our own past european exploits. The dons were very lucky indeed to acquire a fantastic team in the early eighties which is when they achieved their european glory.

However it was our club that was at the forefront of the european adventures in the very early fifties as you will very probably know already.

We were invited to participate as the first british club to play in the european cup in 1955/56 because of our prestige at that time. We went on to compete to the semi final stage which is a monumental achievement for our club and was a proud moment for Scottish Football.

We since went on to have a number of memorable results on our european journeys beating Barcelona and Napoli and many other notable victories.

So I would say there is possibly a case for our club having the better overall european history than the dons and of course the Yams because of our many adventures and the prestige of being the first ever british club to participate in the european cup.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/scotland/sports...43/print.shtml

A decent article by the BBC on the earlier history of scottish clubs in europe.

Glory Glory

Cheers for the link mate.

Here is another, and presumably a fairly objective view, from one of the best papers around for football coverage.

Really does put the Famous Five's exploits into come context.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2010/feb/26/joy-of-six-matches-never-were

[northstandhibby]

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Cheers for the link mate.

Here is another, and presumably a fairly objective view, from one of the best papers around for football coverage.

Really does put the Famous Five's exploits into come context.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/bl...hes-never-were

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/bl...hes-never-were

Excellent read.

Loved the quote from Gordon Smith who was sure we would have won the european cup, but for it coming just a couple of years too late.

70 000 at his testimonial against Man Utd and us winning 7-3.

What a team!!!

[SouthsideHarp_Bhoy]

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https://www.theguardian.com/sport/bl...hes-never-were

Excellent read.

Loved the quote from Gordon Smith who was sure we would have won the european cup, but for it coming just a couple of years too late.

70 000 at his testimonial against Man Utd and us winning 7-3.

What a team!!!

Sometimes makes you regret the timea you now live in!

[--------]

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Sometimes makes you regret the time you now live in!

Fair to say that in the late 40's and early 50's Hibs had a great team and were a club with all the potential to become a great football club - if things had worked out differently.

Might even have come again in the 60's with better management.

But for most of my lifetime Hibs have been a middle-range Scottish club ill-run and serially under-performing.

In 50 years I've seen Hibs win the Scottish Cup ONCE, the League Cup THREE times, and the Scottish First Division title (when it was really the SECOND Division title - an entirely unwanted honour) TWICE. Plus how many depressing, dire, embarrassing LOSING performances at Hampden in finals and semi-finals?

Dunno why I still support them ....

[Earlydelivery]

I'm in my middle 50s , and just like to add that turnbull's tornadoes where the best Scottish team I'd ever seen never to win a championship .