Stubbs the wrong appointment!

[matty_f]

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Culture of failure comes from the very top. Won't change till he is gone.

As bored as I am of this league, and these results, this chat is by far and away the most boring of all.

WTF does that even mean? What is Petrie (or STF) doing that is creating a 'culture of failure'?

Where was that culture when we papped the Yams out the cup, or Aberdeen, or St Johnstone, or Dundee Unite (twice), or any of the other significant wins we've had?

What a load of pish.

[Ozyhibby]

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As bored as I am of this league, and these results, this chat is by far and away the most boring of all.

WTF does that even mean? What is Petrie (or STF) doing that is creating a 'culture of failure'?

Where was that culture when we papped the Yams out the cup, or Aberdeen, or St Johnstone, or Dundee Unite (twice), or any of the other significant wins we've had?

What a load of pish.

Deputy heads must roll again?
Stubbs will be gone this time, might need to be leeann next time. So long as it's not him.

[DH1875]

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I remember some on here saying, before he was appointed, that we need someone who knows how to get us out the league as opposed to just a good manager. I thought at the time it was a load of nonsense but I can see what they meant in hindsight.

We've built a team for the premiership, a chuffing good team at that but it's just not effective in this league. I just hope we can turn this around and go up cause we could have quite a good few years ahead if we do. If we don't then I fear for our club.

Think I was the main critic on here when he was appointed. Got shot down and torn to ribbons for it as well. Still don't think he should have been given the job but have tried to get behind him and will continue to do so until the end of the season, there's nothing else we can do. I'm still hopeful he proves me wrong and now isn't the time for I told you so. IF we win promotion then of course he keeps his job.

[matty_f]

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Deputy heads must roll again?
Stubbs will be gone this time, might need to be leeann next time. So long as it's not him.

Is Petrie missing the chances? Did he pick the team? Did he even pick the manager?

How is he creating a 'culture of failure' and where is that culture when we're winning significant games?

[SJM]

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Is Petrie missing the chances? Did he pick the team? Did he even pick the manager?

How is he creating a 'culture of failure' and where is that culture when we're winning significant games?

Why is Petrie still at the club? He's chairman of a club who is in the top 5 biggest clubs in the country staring a third season in the fizzy pop leagues. Of course he has to take a massive proportion of the blame.

[matty_f]

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Why is Petrie still at the club? He's chairman of a club who is in the top 5 biggest clubs in the country staring a third season in the fizzy pop leagues. Of course he has to take a massive proportion of the blame.

I don't know why he's still there. I'm guessing that he brings a bit of experience to the table and is there to help Leeann if and when she needs it.

What is he doing, or has he done, this season that's put us where we are?

[Aldo]

The only way Stubbs keeps his job is if we win promotion. LD said that was our priority and 2 seasons down the line we seem to struggle to get out of the championship.

Stubbs has been backed by the Club and this cannot be denied so it's sudden death for Stubbs and if he doesn't get it right on Saturday and we progress he should go after the Cup Final..... And that's regardless of the outcome.

[SJM]

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I don't know why he's still there. I'm guessing that he brings a bit of experience to the table and is there to help Leeann if and when she needs it.

What is he doing, or has he done, this season that's put us where we are?

I'm not sure as I'm not sure why he's still here but he appointed the CEO who appointed the manager who is looking like failing with their objectives. I'm not completely bashing Petrie but he is the one constant in this shambles. What's happened to youth development too it seems to have been completely abandoned.

[Bobby's Cinema]

He doesn't appear to learn from his mistakes that is the most concerning thing.

[Aldo]

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I don't know why he's still there. I'm guessing that he brings a bit of experience to the table and is there to help Leeann if and when she needs it. What is he doing, or has he done, this season that's put us where we are?

Matty he has done nothing but is still constantly being blamed or scapegoated for the failures of the last 2 years and will continually be blamed as long as he is at club!

[matty_f]

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I'm not sure as I'm not sure why he's still here but he appointed the CEO who appointed the manager who is looking like failing with their objectives. I'm not completely bashing Petrie but he is the one constant in this shambles. What's happened to youth development too it seems to have been completely abandoned.

Far from being completely abandoned the youth set up was pretty much ripped up to start again under Eddie May and Joe McBride.

[Brightside]

Stubbs would be a great manager for us in the top league. Just a shame he can't get us out of this one! Our current squad don't have the blood and guts about them to mix it up in this league. Also when you are playing against 10 men behind the ball you sometimes have to go route one...we don't have the players to do that. SO....if we don't go up this season i actually think we do need someone different in the role...and forget about building for 5 years / 10 years. Its a one season job - get us up.

[Aldo]

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I'm not sure as I'm not sure why he's still here but he appointed the CEO who appointed the manager who is looking like failing with their objectives. I'm not completely bashing Petrie but he is the one constant in this shambles. What's happened to youth development too it seems to have been completely abandoned.

Yes Petrie has been responsible for our decline as such and a good number of other things at at the club since at the very least 2007 but to constantly blame him for our current playing state is beyond me.

The CEO/Club has backed the manager with a number of signing in the last 2 years

McGinn - Transfer fee
Stokes
Fyvie
MacGregor

So it's Petries fault the manager has made some terrible decisions this season (again) and has never learnt from these failings.

[SJM]

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Far from being completely abandoned the youth set up was pretty much ripped up to start again under Eddie May and Joe McBride.

Why did we have to do that? Who's fault it wasn't working in the first place? Let's hope we get a few players from the development side of things in the not too distant future then.

[RIP]

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It's easy to stay positive if you just shift your expectations to suit.

'We should be aiming to win the league'

'We might not win the leaue but we'll run Ranger close'

'Competing with Rangers was always going to be tough, we'll finish clear 2nd'

'We'll pull away from Falkirk eventually'

'It's where we are after the play offs that counts'

'An extra 2 games is no big deal'

'You can clearly see we're tired'

'The cup will make up for the disapointment of staying down anyway'

'Dunfermilne is lovely in January and not winning the cup keeps it interesting for everyone else'

Remember Petrie Oot? A board-manufactured fans investment that reduced Farmer and Petrie's need to invest. No goals, no plan for success, no clue of how to run a football club.

[steakbake]

I think h/net might be a good place to avoid over the next few weeks....

[SJM]

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Yes Petrie has been responsible for our decline as such and a good number of other things at at the club since at the very least 2007 but to constantly blame him for our current playing state is beyond me.

The CEO/Club has backed the manager with a number of signing in the last 2 years

McGinn - Transfer fee
Stokes
Fyvie
MacGregor

So it's Petries fault the manager has made some terrible decisions this season (again) and has never learnt from these failings.

Did you see the bit where I said it's not all Petrie to blame but he appoints the person who appointed the manager. He's still chairman of a club in the Lower leagues and must take a proportion of blame.

[Aldo]

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Did you see the bit where I said it's not all Petrie to blame but he appoints the person who appointed the manager. He's still chairman of a club in the Lower leagues and must take a proportion of blame.

Let's get over the Petrie thing. Yes he is to blame for us being in this ****ty league and yes the buck stops at him being Chairman but ...

Even if he wasn't here this season we'd still be where we are. It's as plain and simple as that.

Too many players not giving a toss and not willing to fit for everything!

[SJM]

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Let's get over the Petrie thing. Yes he is to blame for us being in this ****ty league and yes the buck stops at him being Chairman but ...

Even if he wasn't here this season we'd still be where we are. It's as plain and simple as that.

Too many players not giving a toss and not willing to fit for everything!

Fair dos can't argue with that. Our main issue for me isn't the players, it's the fact we don't look lol a team. We look like a side with good players not having a scoob what their job is. We should have player in the team to do a particular job, it's never happened under Stubbs and he's far too loyal to guys not at peak form. Gunnarson will probably leave in the summer and be a top player.

[CallumLaidlaw]

So a thread is started about Stubbs being the wrong man, and the first few posts are digs at other Hibs fans. Absolutely great. This is meant to be a discussion board not a personal attack board. We all have different opinions of things, thats the whole point of this place.

My opinion - A lot still balances on the next 3 weeks, and Saturday in particular. If we don't progress and get promoted, then he has been a failure. I think even if we win the cup, we will be looking for a new manager in the summer - he may see that as his opportunity to get out on a high.

If we somehow get promoted, then he'll have done the job he was appointed to do, and with his record against Premiership opposition, you'd have to fancy that he'll be in charge come next season, unless again he decides to leave while his stock in the media is high.

I was a huge supporter of Stubbs but his stubborness with his formation and favourite players along with his refusal to change from the plodding, slow build up play makes it very difficult to continue supporting him. I am struggling to see us getting past Raith now, and that sentence alone is a reason to be looking for a new manager.

[matty_f]

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Why did we have to do that? Who's fault it wasn't working in the first place? Let's hope we get a few players from the development side of things in the not too distant future then.

What we had wasn't working, and I think it's patently obvious where the finger should be pointed for that. I have no arguments with that.

But for the here and now, blaming RP for our situation now, is just lazy and doesn't hold a great deal of credibility.

[matty_f]

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So a thread is started about Stubbs being the wrong man, and the first few posts are digs at other Hibs fans. Absolutely great. This is meant to be a discussion board not a personal attack board. We all have different opinions of things, thats the whole point of this place.

My opinion - A lot still balances on the next 3 weeks, and Saturday in particular. If we don't progress and get promoted, then he has been a failure. I think even if we win the cup, we will be looking for a new manager in the summer - he may see that as his opportunity to get out on a high.

If we somehow get promoted, then he'll have done the job he was appointed to do, and with his record against Premiership opposition, you'd have to fancy that he'll be in charge come next season, unless again he decides to leave while his stock in the media is high.

I was a huge supporter of Stubbs but his stubborness with his formation and favourite players along with his refusal to change from the plodding, slow build up play makes it very difficult to continue supporting him. I am struggling to see us getting past Raith now, and that sentence alone is a reason to be looking for a new manager.

If we go up then third place and last night don't really matter. If we don't then they become very significant failures.

[Ozyhibby]

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What we had wasn't working, and I think it's patently obvious where the finger should be pointed for that. I have no arguments with that.

But for the here and now, blaming RP for our situation now, is just lazy and doesn't hold a great deal of credibility.

Unless his latest set of changes aren't working either? How long do we wait this time?

[Aldo]

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Fair dos can't argue with that. Our main issue for me isn't the players, it's the fact we don't look lol a team. We look like a side with good players not having a scoob what their job is. We should have player in the team to do a particular job, it's never happened under Stubbs and he's far too loyal to guys not at peak form. Gunnarson will probably leave in the summer and be a top player.

It's not all about having good players it's about the team and having a good balance.

I'll go back to McLeish's team and the likes of Paul Fenwick, Gary Smith, Matty Jack

Guys that might not have been the most gifted players but complemented the others giving the team a balance.

We don't have that we have individuals who are good players but that doesn't make a team IMHO.

I really don't know where we go if we don't get promoted but Stubbs has to step aside!

[Alfred E Newman]

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Culture of failure comes from the very top. Won't change till he is gone.

Utter rubbish.

[Ozyhibby]

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Utter rubbish.

Wher do you think our consistent failure over the last 9 years has come from then?

[SJM]

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What we had wasn't working, and I think it's patently obvious where the finger should be pointed for that. I have no arguments with that.

But for the here and now, blaming RP for our situation now, is just lazy and doesn't hold a great deal of credibility.

He's part of the problem and should get a proportion of blame. He's not sitting doing nothing as chairman of the club after all. Top to bottom everyone has the responsibility to get us out this league.

[matty_f]

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Unless his latest set of changes aren't working either? How long do we wait this time?

Long enough to see if they work?

Not sure what line of work you're in but there are some changes which show an immediate improvement, and some which will give long term improvements.

You're not going to see a huge shift in youth development in a season, for example.

[J-C]

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He changed from 352 back to the 442 diamond last night so you're just wrong that there's no plan b. And we beat Aberdeen in the cup despite them having more of the play for large chunks of the game. 'Having more of the ball' vs 'sitting deep' isn't usually a tactical choice by the manager, it's a result of the quality of the opposition. We tend to lose against lower league opposition by being caught on the break, i agree. That a not a tactical fault though, it's just the way a lower league team will play against us 90% of the time.

And the 4-4-2 diamond has also struggled to work against these teams, he played a 4-4-2 against QOS who played the same as Raith with one up top and we won 2-0, we had 3 centre halfs, Bartley, Fyvie who is defensive minded all sitting there trying to control the middle and stop Raith. We had no creativity on the park apart from Stokes and he very rarely plays where he's meant to as a striker, he always drops deep to get the ball. The same team that played on sunday should've started last night, too much tinkering again from Stubbs, you have a winning team, leave it.

[Ozyhibby]

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Long enough to see if they work?

Not sure what line of work you're in but there are some changes which show an immediate improvement, and some which will give long term improvements.

You're not going to see a huge shift in youth development in a season, for example.

I think when we got relegated there was a need for the type of changes which show an immediate improvement.