Loyalty Scheme - Back To The Drawing Board

[lucky]

The two areas where the loyalty points need looked at in my opinion are;
PATG away games, surely keeping your ticket stubb and getting the points added at a later date could work.
The points fresh hold for tickets release. The second grouping at the PBS was too big.

As for HSL points, I would give 100 points per year on the bases that you must pay your £225 each year. As these fans are putting extra cash into Hibs in the same way those who bought a cup top for £50 were rewarded with points for every home cup game.

[Sudds_1]

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I get your point, I miss quite a few games each season, it certainly makes no financial sense for me to have a season ticket, but I do because I want to support the club. My commitment amounts to a season ticket, a cup top up and 4-5 away games, but I don't get annoyed (nor do I feel I'd have any right to) if I miss out on a chance to get a ticket for Ibrox because someone else has a greater commitment.

Those odd big games though are exactly that, ones where (like Hearts) even season ticket holders had a mad scramble for tickets, there is no guarantee they'd get one.

If we were to weigh up season ticket holders who buy a ticket for the extra chance of getting a big away game ticket (I can't see there being that many, but clearly will be some) vs walk-ups who go to an extra game because it'll move them into a higher wave, I'd imagine there would be more of the latter. From there I understand your conclusion that priority one is ST holders and priority two is points bands below ST. If we had points for walk-ups only then of course it's unlikely that the 'home and away' fans would be put off, it's what they do on a Saturday, but there is now the facility to reward that hard core.

I won't be the same for everyone of course, but if we balance money lost because of the odd season ticket holder that buys one to have a better chance of tickets for away games vs keeping your most loyal fans/customers happy then I'd plump for the latter. As you said, it is a fairer system, so if I was one of the 'buy ST for a chance of a big away game' supporters I wouldn't blame Hibs for being fair and looking after the most loyal. If I felt there were many of those 'better chance' holders saying they wouldn't renew my opinion would probably be different...

See, that's he point for me......define commitment. I'm like you....season ticket every year, plus cup top up, plus away games when I can. But circumstances mean I cant use it to its fullest. But all putting much needed cash into my club a point in the early year when they need it. Is that showing less commitment than others? In my view its demonstrating commitment by putting my hand in my pocket before the season starts............. and having faith in my team .

Others might call that LOYALTY? :-)

[Lancs Harp]

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It just occurred to me that another cost the club will now be taking on is the admin of away tickets. When I go to away games I usually pay at the gate. Now that loyalty points are on offer, I'll buy from Hibs and get them to post to me. The admin cost for that transaction has moved from the away team to Hibs. Hibs get no money for selling away tickets.


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Not sure if its the same in Scotland as England but in England but the away team gets 10% of the ticket money it sells

[Pete]

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Its fine. No idea how so many people moan about

[marinello59]

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The two areas where the loyalty points need looked at in my opinion are;
PATG away games, surely keeping your ticket stubb and getting the points added at a later date could work.
The points fresh hold for tickets release. The second grouping at the PBS was too big.

As for HSL points, I would give 100 points per year on the bases that you must pay your £225 each year. As these fans are putting extra cash into Hibs in the same way those who bought a cup top for £50 were reward with points for every home cup game.

What's to stop people handing away stubs to others to gain points? Ive had to pay for a couple of away games at the gate this season for us because it is sometimes difficult to buy in advance, especially for out of towners. That's just the way the cookie crumble though.
Then again I have already said I'd ditch points for away games altogether to allow those who actually pay at our gate to benefit most from this scheme.
Being guaranteed tickets for the big games is a nice wee perk and I am taking full advantage but looking at the bigger picture, why should a minority benefit at the expense of those who pay our own club money on a regular basis? Unless they buy season tickets they can never reach the top group for tickets.
I got loyalty points for my attendance at both Ibrox and the PBS. Surely getting a ticket was the reward, why on earth should I have been moved even further in front of people desperate for a ticket for those games?

[My_Wife_Camille]

The more games you attend, the more chance you have of getting tickets for in demand games.

Seriously, what is the problem?

I've read tonnes of these threads and all the complaints stem from one thing, people complaining because they're not getting their own way.

The system works exactly how it's supposed to. If you want more points, go to more games. If you can't/won't do that then tough, the ones that do go every week shouldn't have to be put at a disadvantage because of that.

The only change I would make is removing the term 'Loyalty' because people twist the word in all ways in order to make their point. Call them something simple like Attendace Points and award them for attending games only and remove all doubt for those claiming that buying a mug from the club store should somehow entitle them to priority tickets.

[SteveHFC]

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The more games you attend, the more chance you have of getting tickets for in demand games.

Seriously, what is the problem?

I've read tonnes of these threads and all the complaints stem from one thing, people complaining because they're not getting their own way.

The system works exactly how it's supposed to. If you want more points, go to more games. If you can't/won't do that then tough, the ones that do to every shouldn't have to be put at a disadvantage because of that.

The only change I would make is removing the term 'Loyalty' because people twist the word in all ways in order to make their point. Call them something simple like Attendace Points and award them for attending games only and remove all doubt for those claiming that buying a mug from the club store should somehow entitle them to priority tickets.

[CentreLine]

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It just occurred to me that another cost the club will now be taking on is the admin of away tickets. When I go to away games I usually pay at the gate. Now that loyalty points are on offer, I'll buy from Hibs and get them to post to me. The admin cost for that transaction has moved from the away team to Hibs. Hibs get no money for selling away tickets.


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Fair enough but if the club feel that the "foot-fall" of supporters buying from the club is worth it for the community spirit it can generate then it is essentially cheap advertising. The club are working hard to connect with supporters. They will not always get it right but the effort is certainly being put in. One such effort, you would immagine, is to connect with supporters through direct sales.

[marinello59]

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The more games you attend, the more chance you have of getting tickets for in demand games.

Seriously, what is the problem?

I've read tonnes of these threads and all the complaints stem from one thing, people complaining because they're not getting their own way.

The system works perfectly for me. I just like moaning anyway though.

[21.05.2016]

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The more games you attend, the more chance you have of getting tickets for in demand games.

Seriously, what is the problem?

I've read tonnes of these threads and all the complaints stem from one thing, people complaining because they're not getting their own way.

The system works exactly how it's supposed to. If you want more points, go to more games. If you can't/won't do that then tough, the ones that do go every week shouldn't have to be put at a disadvantage because of that.

The only change I would make is removing the term 'Loyalty' because people twist the word in all ways in order to make their point. Call them something simple like Attendace Points and award them for attending games only and remove all doubt for those claiming that buying a mug from the club store should somehow entitle them to priority tickets.

I 100% agree. I think, although not completely perfect, it is the best and fairest way IMO.

[lucky]

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What's to stop people handing away stubs to others to gain points? Ive had to pay for a couple of away games at the gate this season for us because it is sometimes difficult to buy in advance, especially for out of towners. That's just the way the cookie crumble though.
Then again I have already said I'd ditch points for away games altogether to allow those who actually pay at our gate to benefit most from this scheme.
Being guaranteed tickets for the big games is a nice wee perk and I am taking full advantage but looking at the bigger picture, why should a minority benefit at the expense of those who pay our own club money on a regular basis? Unless they buy season tickets they can never reach the top group for tickets.
I got loyalty points for my attendance at both Ibrox and the PBS. Surely getting a ticket was the reward, why on earth should I have been moved even further in front of people desperate for a ticket for those games?

As Hibs issue tickets at ER they will or could keep track of who got what ticket then only those who PATG for the away game would get the points.

It's a good point you make with regards to Ibrox & PBS, but is the alternative not to giving points for away games that sell? Just think that could get even more complicated.

[Nakedmanoncrack]

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I'm not in the Scotland Supporters Club so don't know how it works but is there not a possibility of people buying away tickets to keep their points total up and not actually attend the game.

It does happen, but not as much as some people make out.

[NAE NOOKIE]

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The scheme does reward those supporters who go to the most games, they just rightly prioritise home attendance over away.

Read the initial launch material from the club. They stated at the time that points may be awarded for non-ticket purchases in the future. Nobody moved any goalposts.

Nobody had an issue with that because not unreasonably they would have been under the impression that points would be awarded on a fair and equitable basis ...... It doesn't matter a toss where the goals are if you're not allowed to play in the first place.

Awarding loyalty points to HSL members but not independent buyers is just like awarding loyalty points to fans who go to away games by bus and none to fans who travel by car ....... anybody who doesn't get that doesn't understand basic logic, never mind fairness.

[wookie70]

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Re the bit in bold, so a season ticket holder who decides that he/she wanted to attend their first away match at Tynecastle last weekend should get the same chance to get a ticket as a supporter who has been to Cowdenbeath, Alloa and Morton in the pouring rain and freezing cold. ??

I think the awarding of the points is pretty much spot on. If it will discourage season ticket sales then add a bonus for season tickets over attending all home game patg. There are a couple of issues for me.

The HSL grinds as loyalty to me, when it comes to football, is about putting your bum on a seat not your hand in you pocket. My other issue is the way the bands for tickets have been arranged. First derby was ridiculous imo. Someone who got 180 points last season and hadn't went to a game home or away this season had equal rights to someone who bought STs both years and attended a good few other games. That seems silly to me and the second tranche could have been for those with over 330 points or similar and it would still have sold out easily.

The semi final was well handled as was the game at Ibrox. Restricted time scale has came into play for the replay so I think they get pass marks for that.

All in all I think it has been a good thing. In time I think it will provide exactly what it was intended to provide - Loyal fans getting tickets for premium games. The replay show what can happen and hopefully gives us a glimse into the future. It also proves the value of a current ST regardless of loyalty points.

[MWHIBBIES]

Current system is just fine thanks.

[CapitalGreen]

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Nobody had an issue with that because not unreasonably they would have been under the impression that points would be awarded on a fair and equitable basis ...... It doesn't matter a toss where the goals are if you're not allowed to play in the first place.

Awarding loyalty points to HSL members but not independent buyers is just like awarding loyalty points to fans who go to away games by bus and none to fans who travel by car ....... anybody who doesn't get that doesn't understand basic logic, never mind fairness.

Hibs award 10 points to people who pre-purchase a home ticket but 0 points to those that buy at the ticket pods. Hibs have used the allocation of points to drive consumer behaviour in their preferred direction.

The HSL loyalty points was available to all, nobody was prevented from taking advantage of this.

[Billy Whizz]

Think of the bun right next season when Budgie gives us 2,000 tickets for Tynie. Keep going to the games and renewing your season ticket will be so important

[Ozyhibby]

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Think of the bun right next season when Budgie gives us 2,000 tickets for Tynie. Keep going to the games and renewing your season ticket will be so important

And sign up for HSL Billy.


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[Ozyhibby]

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Think of the bun right next season when Budgie gives us 2,000 tickets for Tynie. Keep going to the games and renewing your season ticket will be so important

Actually, with the policing issues they are having I think they may still give us the whole stand.


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[Billy Whizz]

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And sign up for HSL Billy.


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And that too

[Billy Whizz]

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Actually, with the policing issues they are having I think they may still give us the whole stand.


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Don't think 13,000 season ticket holders will fit into 3 stands

[blackpoolhibs]

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What's to stop people handing away stubs to others to gain points? Ive had to pay for a couple of away games at the gate this season for us because it is sometimes difficult to buy in advance, especially for out of towners. That's just the way the cookie crumble though.
Then again I have already said I'd ditch points for away games altogether to allow those who actually pay at our gate to benefit most from this scheme.
Being guaranteed tickets for the big games is a nice wee perk and I am taking full advantage but looking at the bigger picture, why should a minority benefit at the expense of those who pay our own club money on a regular basis? Unless they buy season tickets they can never reach the top group for tickets.
I got loyalty points for my attendance at both Ibrox and the PBS. Surely getting a ticket was the reward, why on earth should I have been moved even further in front of people desperate for a ticket for those games?

Exactly.

[Ozyhibby]

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Don't think 13,000 season ticket holders will fit into 3 stands

They may have to make those roseburn season tickets cat B only for a reduced price?


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[Super_JMcGinn]

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What's to stop people handing away stubs to others to gain points? Ive had to pay for a couple of away games at the gate this season for us because it is sometimes difficult to buy in advance, especially for out of towners. That's just the way the cookie crumble though.
Then again I have already said I'd ditch points for away games altogether to allow those who actually pay at our gate to benefit most from this scheme.
Being guaranteed tickets for the big games is a nice wee perk and I am taking full advantage but looking at the bigger picture, why should a minority benefit at the expense of those who pay our own club money on a regular basis? Unless they buy season tickets they can never reach the top group for tickets.
I got loyalty points for my attendance at both Ibrox and the PBS. Surely getting a ticket was the reward, why on earth should I have been moved even further in front of people desperate for a ticket for those games?

Pretty much where I stand on it

[Billy Whizz]

There is something in the fact that the rich get richer. Maybe don't give loyalty points for Tynie/Ibrox. Means that fans that go to all the smaller grounds are still top points earners and will get 1st dibs

[jodjam]

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Think of the bun right next season when Budgie gives us 2,000 tickets for Tynie. Keep going to the games and renewing your season ticket will be so important

Your point is correct for the ones near the top of the loyalty points who will need to renew to stay there but for myself (1 point short of top group) then a reduced capacity will mean I have little chance.

[BSEJVT]

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I don't accept that it can't be changed.

I honestly have no probs with the fairness of the system or the awarding of points for other things.
I really just don't want people not renewing season tickets because of it.


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Not the point I was making

You were complaining re costs, point I was making is they are a fact of life and benefits outweigh IMO costs.

They should consult support on what changes they would like and go with consensus view

[NAE NOOKIE]

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Hibs award 10 points to people who pre-purchase a home ticket but 0 points to those that buy at the ticket pods. Hibs have used the allocation of points to drive consumer behaviour in their preferred direction.

The HSL loyalty points was available to all, nobody was prevented from taking advantage of this.

Your first point is true, but I would imagine its because there is no computer facility in the pods to allocate points with ... I still don't see why ticket stubbs from the pods cant be exchanged at the TO at a later date for points, something Hibs could look at in the future perhaps.

What you are saying with your second point is that people who bought shares independently, if they want to achieve parity with HSL members, should double their input to the club ... by that logic its not unreasonable then to only award loyalty points to HSL members who first buy shares privately as well.

The fact that folk can join HSL is entirely beside the point .... I wont be treated differently from my fellow supporters by the club when my input has been exactly the same. Mind you, think of the money we could make if Hibbies without an EH postcode had to pay double for tickets, perhaps the logic Hibs have applied here could be extended to that.

[CapitalGreen]

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Your first point is true, but I would imagine its because there is no computer facility in the pods to allocate points with ... I still don't see why ticket stubbs from the pods cant be exchanged at the TO at a later date for points, something Hibs could look at in the future perhaps.

What you are saying with your second point is that people who bought shares independently, if they want to achieve parity with HSL members, should double their input to the club ... by that logic its not unreasonable then to only award loyalty points to HSL members who first buy shares privately as well.

The fact that folk can join HSL is entirely beside the point .... I wont be treated differently from my fellow supporters by the club when my input has been exactly the same. Mind you, think of the money we could make if Hibbies without an EH postcode had to pay double for tickets, perhaps the logic Hibs have applied here could be extended to that.

You have already had it explained to you multiple times how HSL membership differs from owning shares in Hibernian FC. If you don't understand the difference or choose to ignore it then that's your problem.

To reverse the argument. Why as a HSL member do I not receive a copy of the annual accounts and an invite to the AGM? Why does my HSL membership not entitle me to a vote on matters raised at AGMs? Why can't I sell my HSL membership on? Where is my share certificate?

As a HSL member I demand the same rights and benefits of a shareholder!

... oh wait, I knowingly signed up for something different.

[Scouse Hibee]

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Hibs award 10 points to people who pre-purchase a home ticket but 0 points to those that buy at the ticket pods. Hibs have used the allocation of points to drive consumer behaviour in their preferred direction.

The HSL loyalty points was available to all, nobody was prevented from taking advantage of this.

Of course they have, one of the main points of any loyalty scheme is to drive or steer consumer behaviour in the direction that the business wants them to go. I have no problem with the loyalty scheme and don't think it needs to go back to the drawing board either, in fact I think that stance would be ridiculous to the extreme.