Malonga

[Stevie Reid]

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Its the bloody first division!!! Have some ambition man.

Also a few of those goals have been doubles in the same game.

Christ, where do I start with this? How might I display ambition in a thread like this - by castigating Malonga when he's been very good for us? And given that our current ambition is to get out of this division, I would say that someone with a strike rate like Malonga would be a great help.

Furthermore, he's scored more than one goal on more than one occasion - are you saying that this is a bad thing, or somehow shouldn't count towards his goal tally?

Lastly - yes, this is the first division we're playing in. Malonga has scored a lot of goals in it. On top of that, he's played against two SPL sides this season, and scored three goals in those two appearances.

Other than that, good post

[truehibernian]

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Christ, where do I start with this? How might I display ambition in a thread like this - by castigating Malonga when he's been very good for us? And given that our current ambition is to get out of this division, I would say that someone with a strike rate like Malonga would be a great help.

Furthermore, he's scored more than one goal on more than one occasion - are you saying that this is a bad thing, or somehow shouldn't count towards his goal tally?

Lastly - yes, this is the first division we're playing in. Malonga has scored a lot of goals in it. On top of that, he's played against two SPL sides this season, and scored three goals in those two appearances.

Other than that, good post :errr:

I'm afraid Stevie he needs to up his game - pronto - business end of the season this lad should, for Hibs and his own CV be knocking his pan in - truth is he is not.

[J-C]

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Totally agree, lazy frustrating player who looked completely disinterested today

But Andy74 said he worked hard today

[Stevie Reid]

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I'm afraid Stevie he needs to up his game - pronto - business end of the season this lad should, for Hibs and his own CV be knocking his pan in - truth is he is not.

He's not the only one, TH. Last week's performance and this week's result aren't good enough - but I'm not suddenly doubting the quality of our management team and playing staff.

Who knows what will happen from here? But Malonga has played a big part (along with many others) in getting us into a position that we didn't think possible a couple of months ago.

It's how reactive people are that really winds me up - a couple of weeks ago there were people on here who were claiming that Rangers would be lucky to finish top four - now, after a couple of wins for them and defeats for us, we're hopeless and won't go up.

There's a long way to go yet, and things can change very quickly.

[hibsbollah]

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Its the bloody first division!!! Have some ambition man.

Also a few of those goals have been doubles in the same game.

post of the year. Stupid Malonga, not spacing out his goals evenly across the season.

[StevieC]

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F*** sake. Are you not allowed to score doubles and hat tricks???

The way you have worded that appears to be you are slagging him for scoring more than one goal in a game.

I took the wording to mean that he has failed to score in more than 50% of the games he's played in. And I would tend to agree, that sort of ratio is pretty poor in the Championship for our main striker.

[scoopyboy]

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I took the wording to mean that he has failed to score in more than 50% of the games he's played in. And I would tend to agree, that sort of ratio is pretty poor in the Championship for our main striker.

The new blue eyed boy of English football could have the same argument flung at him.

Harry Kane has eighteen goals in thirty odd games but because he bagged a hat trick last time out against bottom club Leicester means he has had a few games where he hasn't scored any. Does that make him any less a striker?

From my point of view the total number of goals is the meaningful stat whether they come in singles, braces or hat tricks.

[marinello59]

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But Andy74 said he worked hard today

And Andy74 was right. We can argue about how effective he was but to suggest he wasn't trying is simply wrong. DM will have been hurting as much as the rest of the team at the final score.

[StevieC]

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The new blue eyed boy of English football could have the same argument flung at him.

Harry Kane has eighteen goals in thirty odd games but because he bagged a hat trick last time out against bottom club Leicester means he has had a few games where he hasn't scored any. Does that make him any less a striker?

From my point of view the total number of goals is the meaningful stat whether they come in singles, braces or hat tricks.

How many would HK score in the English League One though, that's the point that is being made. If DM had scored 13 in the Premiership, or we viewed ourselves as nothing more than a Championship team, then it wouldn't be too bad a return.
But if we feel we are a Premiership team, and dominating games against Championship teams, then its not that good a return. And certainly not that good a return to make him exempt from criticism when he can be seen to be giving less than 100% effort.

[blackpoolhibs]

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But Andy74 said he worked hard today

I thought he played well in the first half, but he was poor in the 2nd.

[hibsbollah]

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He rightly got 'abuse' when he didn't chase down a ball second half......as a result he did, closed down, and keep them pinned at their byeline - and he received applause - it ain't rocket science football - try a leg and you'll get praise, don't you'll get both found out and lambasted

He needs to realise it is Scotland, and lower league football, not Italy and Serie A and B

i don't want Malonga changing his game because of pressure from the 'up and at 'em' brigade' amongst our support, to be honest. Malongas game is based on good positioning, intelligent runs and changes in pace. Running about chasing lost causes into the corner flags to win us an extra three yards might get him applause, but it's not necessarily the best thing for the team.

[scoopyboy]

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How many would HK score in the English League One though, that's the point that is being made. If DM had scored 13 in the Premiership, or we viewed ourselves as nothing more than a Championship team, then it wouldn't be too bad a return.
But if we feel we are a Premiership team, and dominating games against Championship teams, then its not that good a return. And certainly not that good a return to make him exempt from criticism when he can be seen to be giving less than 100% effort.

I think we aren't discussing the same thing Stevie.

Undoubtably Harry Kane would score more in the Championship in England.

The point I was making was that goals scored in a season should be seen as just that irrespective of whether they come in ones, twos or threes. The original pop I had was at poster who seemed to have a go at him for scoring more than one in a game as opposed to scoring one in more games.

Just to add more fuel to the fire Malonga has played two games against top flight opposition and scored two against Ross County and one against Dundee Utd so his record against "better teams" is favourable against his league ratio.

[blackpoolhibs]

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I think we aren't discussing the same thing Stevie.

Undoubtably Harry Kane would score more in the Championship in England.

The point I was making was that goals scored in a season should be seen as just that irrespective of whether they come in ones, twos or threes. The original pop I had was at poster who seemed to have a go at him for scoring more than one in a game as opposed to scoring one in more games.

Just to add more fuel to the fire Malonga has played two games against top flight opposition and scored two against Ross County and one against Dundee Utd so his record against "better teams" is favourable against his league ratio.

Thats a very good point, and one i think points to him getting more space and time against the better sides. Against teams that will attack us more, i think he will be more effective.

The only thing that may work against us seeing that, is if we are still in the Championship when his contract runs out?

[J-C]

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I thought he played well in the first half, but he was poor in the 2nd.

Can only go by what is written here as I wasn't there, some saying he was poor and lazy, others sayng he was ok especially in the 1st half, just getting conflicting views that's all, my opinion is he aint and never will be a main striker, he plays better as 1 of 2 as he drops deeper.

[Hermit Crab]

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i don't want Malonga changing his game because of pressure from the 'up and at 'em' brigade' amongst our support, to be honest. Malongas game is based on good positioning, intelligent runs and changes in pace. Running about chasing lost causes into the corner flags to win us an extra three yards might get him applause, but it's not necessarily the best thing for the team.

That's all very well. The above in bold he done none of yesterday.

[Leithenhibby]

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Jeezo.

The last 2 weeks have been tough and I must admit I have started to question both the mental toughness in the squad and the how much the countless missed chances over the course of the season are goingt to cost us.

But do we really need thread slaughtering all our players. Oxley has been getting on both here and the PM board all week and now it seems Malonga is in the firing line.

It's what Hibs fans do, always have always will. I have followed my beloved team for longer than I care to remember and over the years have had feedback from ex players stating how nasty it can become!!...

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People are frustrated as we appear to be heading for yet another failure of a season.
It may still be a success but it's not looking good tonight.

I would have taken our present position at the start........

[madhatter]

He needs a partner upfront. To those that say he needs to up his work rate etc. May I point to the best players in the world...neither Messi and Ronaldo do anything when they lose the ball (especially Messi). By no means is Malonga in same league but sadly along with Scott Allan, they are luxury players. Scott Allan rarely chases back but I don't criticise. Listening to the game yesterday, sadly it sounds like McGeouch has had 2 bad games in a row. Seemed like he gave the ball away a lot by his standards.

[Turkish Green]

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I think we aren't discussing the same thing Stevie.

Undoubtably Harry Kane would score more in the Championship in England.

The point I was making was that goals scored in a season should be seen as just that irrespective of whether they come in ones, twos or threes. The original pop I had was at poster who seemed to have a go at him for scoring more than one in a game as opposed to scoring one in more games.

Just to add more fuel to the fire Malonga has played two games against top flight opposition and scored two against Ross County and one against Dundee Utd so his record against "better teams" is favourable against his league ratio.

i think this throws up a debatable point. Against supposed "better" opposition there is more space as these opponents are expected to attack the Championship team. However against teams from the lower half of the Championship they pack their defences and give less space. The yams have gotten around this by goals from outside of the penalty box forcing defences to open up. Hibs on the other hand appear to want to walk the ball into the net.

Malonga is a good player who may not always fit into the square hole designated for him by Stubbs. For me the question mark should be against JJJ.

[StevieC]

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The original pop I had was at poster who seemed to have a go at him for scoring more than one in a game as opposed to scoring one in more games.

This is why I replied to your post. I felt you may have picked the original poster up wrong, because I felt the poster was saying that he didn't score in enough games rather than having a go for scoring more than one in a game.

Regardless of the original post though, my personal view is that I don't rate Malonga. I think we could have, and should have, somebody better at converting the numerous chances we are creating.

[scoopyboy]

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This is why I replied to your post. I felt you may have picked the original poster up wrong, because I felt the poster was saying that he didn't score in enough games rather than having a go for scoring more than one in a game.

Regardless of the original post though, my personal view is that I don't rate Malonga. I think we could have, and should have, somebody better at converting the numerous chances we are creating.

Fair enough Stevie.

Strikers can't choose when they score, ie its not as if a striker can say I shouldn't have scored a second goal today as I should have saved it for next week.

Any striker who scores a lot of goals in a season will always have multiples included and will always have games when they don't score.

Without knowing for sure I would wager that when Joe Baker scored 42 goals in a season there would have been several games when he didn't score and in those games it's probable that Hibs didn't win.

Malonga is a bit of a mixed bag and am not sure if I rate him or not, he certainly infuriates me at times. I'm not convinced he is particularly lazy as I think he tends to time his runs and doesn't run around like a headless chickens. He tends to drift wide and gets the ball in space a lot of time.

It would be interesting to get a figure on how many yards he does in a game, similar to what you see in a Champions League when a player gets subbed.

[StevieC]

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Malonga is a bit of a mixed bag and am not sure if I rate him or not, he certainly infuriates me at times. I'm not convinced he is particularly lazy as I think he tends to time his runs and doesn't run around like a headless chickens. He tends to drift wide and gets the ball in space a lot of time.

I feel the same.
Watch him closely in the Raith Highlights. He rarely shows a change of pace, doesn't try to get across the front of his marker, static and no awareness (or hunger) to get onto anything loose in the box. Watch the amount of times that if he had shown a burst of pace into the box, when we broke down the wings, he might have managed to get on the end of something. The one chance he did have was down to the quality of the cross, and he really should have finished that header.

In comparison, both Raith goals were scored by the attacker cutting across the front of his marker to create the yard or two needed to get a shot off.

[eastcoasthibby]

I would go with those seeing Malonga as having had a pretty decent first half yesterday and then the style of the game changed, there was not as much space to play in and our play was for the most painstakingly slow, we were trying to play through the middle in a packed area where the bigger Raith defenders were almost always the winners. This style in my eyes does not suit Malonga, I watched him try to make a couple of runs off defenders to give his team mates options and like too often they made the wrong decision and pass.
Malonga will never be the type to go straight up against and have a physical battle with some of the centre backs in this league, therefore playing him when the game gets like that is almost pointless and for me the last 2 games have reflected that apart form the first half yesterday. Malonga dropped of yesterday to try and get the ball especially in the second half a few times but it was all too tight and we were intent in trying to get the ball either through the middle in the packed area or making 4 passes to get it from one side to the other, so my response is agreeing that Malonga lost the place the second half, had a really decent first half and is not the answer in a physical encounter where there is no space and we are asking him to challenge robustly.
He is a good footballer, with a lovely touch he can take a goal, but is no poacher, a more open playing system suits him and he has been and is a valuable player to us, I think we need to understand him better and take a view that AS has 5 main strikers who all have different attributes and game style preferences, he needs to find the right ones for the right games and styles of play.
All IMHO from a seasons worth of viewing majority of it enjoyable i have to say, long may that continue.
GGTTH

[Unseen work]

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i don't want Malonga changing his game because of pressure from the 'up and at 'em' brigade' amongst our support, to be honest. Malongas game is based on good positioning, intelligent runs and changes in pace. Running about chasing lost causes into the corner flags to win us an extra three yards might get him applause, but it's not necessarily the best thing for the team.

100%

[Hibeesmad]

I like him, I thinks he's a good player and we will see the best of him with El Alagui. Just remember that he only joined in September and he's been away on international duty for numerous amount of weeks. One of our best signings imo

[Unseen work]

People are comparing Malonga to harry kane, and how kane would score more goals in the championship.

IMO this isnt always the case, as hibs are one of the best teams in the championship it means when teams play us they generally set out to defend and hit us on the counter. Putting 10 men behind the ball leaves us with little space to create clear cut chances. If we played in the premiership malonga would have much more space to run into and get shots away as other teams will try match us or win the game which would leave them with gaps at the back for him to exploit.

Interestingly harry kanes record at lower league teams isnt great. Granted he was younger at leyton orient, but 13 and 2 at leicester was only last season

2011	→ Leyton Orient (loan)	18	(5)
2012	→ Millwall (loan)	22	(7)
2012–2013	→ Norwich City (loan)	3	(0)
2013	→ Leicester City (loan)	13	(2

[Bearders]

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over the years have had feedback from ex players stating how nasty it can become!!...

Rowan Vine, Michael Stewart, Alan O"Brien ??

[truehibernian]

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i don't want Malonga changing his game because of pressure from the 'up and at 'em' brigade' amongst our support, to be honest. Malongas game is based on good positioning, intelligent runs and changes in pace. Running about chasing lost causes into the corner flags to win us an extra three yards might get him applause, but it's not necessarily the best thing for the team.

It's not about changing his game at all bollah, simply adding to his game - The Rangers beat us because McCall recognised Hibs like possession and he asked his players, specifically his front men, to press high and force mistakes - watch that game again and watch where Kenny Miller, Clark and others are when Oxley gets the ball and rolls it to Fontaine, Hanlon or the full backs - we were forced often to play long or indeed our game was narrowed.

Malonga needs to work harder in games - if that means now and again closing down and trying to force and error for the team benefit then so be it - as it turned out the example second half I am talking about resulted in Raith having to take a throw in (rather than be allowed time to pick a pass) - a thrown in which Hibs won possession back, right on the edge of their box.

I'm not asking for 'headless chicken' stuff - but closing down space does not take too much out of you if your positional sense is good to start off with anyway. Too often Malonga was where midfielders are expected to be.

Raith and The Rangers were allowed to have settled banks of 4 or 5, and their centre halves in both games were not troubled in the slightest. Our front men need to adapt during a game because at this stage of the season each and every side have something to play for and will battle.

[hibbysam]

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People are frustrated as we appear to be heading for yet another failure of a season.
It may still be a success but it's not looking good tonight.

Were in the exact same position as we were three weeks ago... We are just as easily on course for one of our best seasons in decades!

[hibsbollah]

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It's not about changing his game at all bollah, simply adding to his game - The Rangers beat us because McCall recognised Hibs like possession and he asked his players, specifically his front men, to press high and force mistakes - watch that game again and watch where Kenny Miller, Clark and others are when Oxley gets the ball and rolls it to Fontaine, Hanlon or the full backs - we were forced often to play long or indeed our game was narrowed.

Malonga needs to work harder in games - if that means now and again closing down and trying to force and error for the team benefit then so be it - as it turned out the example second half I am talking about resulted in Raith having to take a throw in (rather than be allowed time to pick a pass) - a thrown in which Hibs won possession back, right on the edge of their box.

I'm not asking for 'headless chicken' stuff - but closing down space does not take too much out of you if your positional sense is good to start off with anyway. Too often Malonga was where midfielders are expected to be.

Raith and The Rangers were allowed to have settled banks of 4 or 5, and their centre halves in both games were not troubled in the slightest. Our front men need to adapt during a game because at this stage of the season each and every side have something to play for and will battle.

McCalls pressure tactics don't really have anything to do with the Malonga question, does it? I can't be bothered to go over it all again, but in simple terms you think he needs to work harder, I don't think he does. But more than that, you are suggesting that he didnt press the ball, presumably because he wasn't instructed to by Stubbs and the management team, and then, because of being shouted at by the crowd to do so, he changed his behaviour which forced Raith to take a throw in. Would you agree that it is an unhealthy situation for players to respond to barracking in this way? Are we going back to the days where we scream at players to 'launch it' because as a fan base we were too primitive to understand the importance of possession football?

I think pressing the ball high up the pitch is a great tactic, proven again and again to work by all the top teams. But you can't do it for 90 mins, all athletes have limits and Stubbs presumably knows when he wants to employ it. I certainly don't want Dougie Dunderrheid fae Drylaw (no offence to Drylaw, its just alliteration) deciding when we press and when we don't.

[Ronniekirk]

It's unfortunate he is going through a run of games without scoring The fact Cummings has been out as well has left pressure on him to be scoring .The fact he isn't is highlighted more because of this and we have only scored one goal while losing two back to back games
Farid will hopefully help out once fully fit but again he will find the expectation is to hit the ground running
If others don't chip in with goals and we loose there is always going to be a focus on non scoring strikers