Logical conclusion.....Butcher going

[Russ]

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A good manager doesn't take a team that is 7th mid season and relegate them - he should be nowhere near Hibs come start of the season in my opinion. The cloud over the club isn't just because of Rod, although he is a major contributor. Terry Butcher has completely underestimated the job and that is what cost us. I still think he is dazed and confused by it all.

I posted after the 2-1 ER derby defeat that in my time supporting the side, it's the most despressing and morose bench and management team I'd seen at Hibs, ever. The players looked dejected, the staff around the bench looked utterly unhappy. And that was as play raged on - it was very surreal to see.

That in itself conveys itself to the fans and the team. People moan about our fans - we had every right to moan about the management and the players - they lacked fight, desire, passion and above all, there was no smiles on faces around the place.

Next time you look at the side warming up - look at the opposition staff on the pitch, then look at ours - there seems to be no enjoyment. It's crucial to have that in a football side.

Since you brought up the the ER derby game it was the most depressing atmosphere I can ever remember prior to a derby game. I don't know if it was due to it being a Sunday joke time KO but it was brutal. It reminded me of the semi final against them where our much vaunted support once more accepted defeat before a ball was kicked, no wonder it transfers itself on to the pitch.

If Terry stays it will be HIS players he has to work with and they will be professionals, not champagne swilling fannies who don't give a toss about the fans or the club.

[TheReg!]

It will be a mutually agreed termination, I think TB has or will throw the towel in.

[bighairyfaeleith]

Stuart mccall

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[Thecat23]

He's a goner if you ask me. Said from the min we went down that he's be away. Just can't see Leeann keeping him as a lot of fans just won't take to the management team now.

[Green Reaper]

Do we give TB time and let him bring players in to fit into his system? No for me because I think he is not capable and we will end up sacking him and will be left with his players. This then costs to replace/ pay off TB and players or new manager stuck with his players

[Keith_M]

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My reading is that Butcher tried to resign but LD has asked him to take some time to calm down and think about it.
....

From what Dempster said, that sounded about right. She said that people were 'emotional' (I think) and suggested discussing this after his holiday.

Maybe once he's had his break, he could come back with a different view and feel he's ready for the challenge.



p.s I'm not suggesting he should either stay or go, as I keep changing my own mind ;)

[hibeejeebies]

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From what Dempster said, that sounded about right. She said that people were 'emotional' (I think) and suggested discussing this after his holiday.

Maybe once he's had his break, he could come back with a different view and feel he's ready for the challenge.



p.s I'm not suggesting he should either stay or go, as I keep changing my own mind ;)

Interesting how it can be read different ways Keekaboo. My personal take on it was that Leeann was trying to hint to us as much as she could that we should expect a change in management.

Will hopefully find out for certain this week.

[Westie1875]

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He's a goner if you ask me. Said from the min we went down that he's be away. Just can't see Leeann keeping him as a lot of fans just won't take to the management team now.

Agree, I really can't see how he could stay on. Hopefully an announcement on his departure tomorrow and we can all move on.

[nickwhibs]

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Agree, I really can't see how he could stay on. Hopefully an announcement on his departure tomorrow and we can all move on.

Really hope so. Fresh start at all levels is needed.

[RIP Bestie]

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My reading is that Butcher tried to resign but LD has asked him to take some time to calm down and think about it.

This constant cycle of new managers has to stop as it's crippling the club. Each new manager needs to get rid of the players brought in by the previous one and bring in players he wants. Butcher hasn't even had that chance yet.

I know that some say he should have done better with what he had but let's face it, the players were not up to it mentally and couldn't handle the pressure that we, the fans, heaped on them.

The same thing you are saying about the players should surely apply to the manager. The players that failed have a proven track record at other clubs but couldn't cut it here for one reason or another. Butcher came in and made them worse in my opinion. I agree that we cannot continually change managed after every setback but nor can we afford to change players at the rate we have over the past few years. Any good manager should be able to get something out of his employees, Butcher got nothing. Butcher can't cut it at any club where there is an expectancy of success.

[Hibiza]

Butcher & Co

[JustSimplyHibs]

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Stuart mccall

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I'm thinking the same... Butcher out by Weds and McCall new manager by Friday.

Reckon LD knows what she wants and will do her upmost to get it and i just get this feeling that McCall is her man to lead us to the Championship. Looking at her interviews - Butcher is not her man.

Anyone know when the meeting is???

[Glorious St Pat]

Would be a bit of a scoop for LD getting McCall...but why would he come after steering Motherwell to 2nd? Unless he sees the bigger picture and potential here

[bighairyfaeleith]

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Would be a bit of a scoop for LD getting McCall...but why would he come after steering Motherwell to 2nd? Unless he sees the bigger picture and potential here

Money and potential, where can he go with motherwell now?

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[ScottB]

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Would be a bit of a scoop for LD getting McCall...but why would he come after steering Motherwell to 2nd? Unless he sees the bigger picture and potential here

With 'Well cutting costs he's not likely to achieve that again, Hibs is a bigger job, and if he can promote us and lead us to a success, it could well lead to a bigger job.

Bit of a McLeish parallel I guess. A relegated Hibs turning to a Motherwell manager to turn us around...

[Cropley10]

Two plus two equals five.

[Gordy M]

Did albion rovers(3rd div) not put motherwell out the cup under mccall? Wonder how that would go down on here.....

[truehibernian]

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Did albion rovers(3rd div) not put motherwell out the cup under mccall? Wonder how that would go down on here.....

Morton beat Celtic, Raith beat The Rangers.......one off results happen.

M'well have been consistently good throughout a season for the last 3 years. Two second places and a 3rd.

Hibs have been 7th, 11th and relegated.

[bighairyfaeleith]

Not sure if this is true but I hear mccalls salary at well is half of what we pay butchet

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[Just Alf]

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Interesting how it can be read different ways Keekaboo. My personal take on it was that Leeann was trying to hint to us as much as she could that we should expect a change in management.

Will hopefully find out for certain this week.

I tend to agree, LD also said a lot of work was going on behind the scenes re players so it might be the new manager (if there IS one) will be off to a running start?

[Gordy M]

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Morton beat Celtic, Raith beat The Rangers.......one off results happen.

M'well have been consistently good throughout a season for the last 3 years. Two second places and a 3rd.

Hibs have been 7th, 11th and relegated.

Yep i totally agree, hasnt stopped us using it as a stick to beat previous managers with though. That was my point.

[Kaff]

We can't hide behind it as a club I do want to mention that our good form under Butcher was prior to and just following the tragic passing of David Paul, we won one game after his funeral. Did this affect any uplift that we had from his appointment and subsequently was it hard to raise spirits?
We'll never know and as I say we can't hide behind this situation but I thought I would share that observation.

[Eternal Hibbie]

Really hoping to hear that Butcher and Malpas are away by the middle of the week.

Would be delighted if LD can entice Stuart McCall to follow her to Hibs.

What he has achieved with Motherwell over the past two or three seasons has been terrific - what would we have given for these top three finishes and they try to play the game the right way, great fit for us, sign him up on a good length contract Leeann. ;)

[hihohibby]

Butcher can't win. If he stays, he knows he will be under an excruciatingly painful microscope, with every result and performance analysed and dissected, and with the added pressure of having his results measured against those of Hearts and Rangers. If Hibs are chasing both clubs within the first few weeks of a new season the pressures on him will be unbearable.
On the other hand, if Butcher goes, his reputation will be in tatters and he will find it difficult convincing any club of his ability to manage at a higher level and/or under pressure.
If I were in his shoes I think I'd be looking to keep a low profile for a while, take stock of my life and ask myself "Is managing a football club worth the stress?"
For what it's worth, I want him to go -preferably resign at no cost to the club who have paid him handsomely for a shocking performance.

[weonlywon6-2]

LDs meeting with butcher wil be one of the most significant meetings at hibs for a long time,i hope butcher walks away as we need a totally fresh start and i would accept some like ian murray cause it is a work in progress,doubt it will happen
Stuart mccall is the obvious choice for me
Going to be interesting !!

[Pete]

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He's a goner if you ask me. Said from the min we went down that he's be away. Just can't see Leeann keeping him as a lot of fans just won't take to the management team now.

I've read some nonsense from some people on here trying to reinforce their argument by belittling his record at Inverness. It's been needless in my opinion, as you've just stated the most compelling argument for parting company with them.

We need total unity going forward and if a fresh squad is to get a fair chance and 100% support there needs to be no hangovers from relegation. It's all very well talking about fresh starts but when the going gets tough will we collectively turn on the management team? It's all about perception and association and wether they like it or not, they will always be associated with taking us down.

I wouldn't mind them staying as I recognise what they are capable of but the question that needs to be honestly asked by the board is wether it's now too late. Will this be a toxic presence next season?

[Lmc2105]

Having seen the interviews by Leeann on Hibernian TV & when asked the question RE butcher i think the body language said a lot, Having met her in person yesterday i do believe that when they meet this week butcher will be surplus to requirements,

When she was approached we were 7th in the table with a chance of the top Six, between now and then whats happened and a believe that's what she will judge the performance of the manager on.

[Holmesdale Hibs]

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My reading is that Butcher tried to resign but LD has asked him to take some time to calm down and think about it.

This constant cycle of new managers has to stop as it's crippling the club. Each new manager needs to get rid of the players brought in by the previous one and bring in players he wants. Butcher hasn't even had that chance yet.

I know that some say he should have done better with what he had but let's face it, the players were not up to it mentally and couldn't handle the pressure that we, the fans, heaped on them.

My take is almost the same although I'd guess Butcher offered to resign rather than tried to.

I can't decide whether I want him to leave or not. He's had a shocker so far at Hibs but did very well with Inverness, which I don't believe was a fluke and more the result of being given time to build a team.

There's also the practical question of who would replace him and whether we can afford to pay him off. McCall would be great but did we not try and get him after Fenlon left? It's far from a given he'd join us.

With the high manager turnover in recent years, I'm probably leaning towards giving him another chance but not fussed either way and LD seems like a good person to make the decision.

[Greenblood70]

He has to go, there is no way you can relegate a club the size of Hibs from a very, historically poor SPL and expect to keep your job. Given the embarrassing tactics, the fans not seeing anything approaching or resembling football, his extremely outdated motivational techniques, second rate psychological tricks and his point blank refusal to pick our best players at various times due to personality issues I can't wait to see the back of him.

He is an absolute charlatan of a football manager, I would put him right up there with Calderwood and Duffy, and maybe even give the title of worst manager in my lifetime.


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[Pete]

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Having seen the interviews by Leeann on Hibernian TV & when asked the question RE butcher i think the body language said a lot, Having met her in person yesterday i do believe that when they meet this week butcher will be surplus to requirements,

When she was approached we were 7th in the table with a chance of the top Six, between now and then whats happened and a believe that's what she will judge the performance of the manager on.

On the other hand, did she not say she liked "fast-foodflowing, pressing football" when asked what her ideal style was?

That sounds quite Butcherish.