How is Hearts demise going to affect Hibs?

[YehButNoBut]

I'm enjoying the fun and games at Tynie as much as anyone, but how are the events with Hearts going to effect Hibs?

If they go pop will our crowds rise or fall? Would any Jambo's start following Hibs?

What will be the big games we as fans will look forward to, love them or hate them, the Derby is always the big game for me each season and there is no better feeling than when we beat them as per the last game at Tynie & last season's cup tie.

What will be the effect on the players if there is no Derby to look forward to, will it be good or bad?

There are so many other un-answered questions.

It's great fun just now laughing at the Hearts but when the dust settles will this be good or bad for Hibs, just wondered what everyone's thoughts are on this.

:pfgwa

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Very minimal short term pain financially (maybe) then one team one capital city, let the fun begin!

[GlenrothesHibee]

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Very minimal short term pain financially (maybe) then one team one capital city, let the fun begin!

This

[lucky]

Around 10000 less people through the gate, plus a drop in hospitality twice a year. The 10000 is 3600 of them and 1400 Hibs fans at the derby games twice a year. It's like losing a game off the fixture list. if Morton come up they will bring 200/300. So it's another big hit for Hibs. The demise of them effects us the most out of the rest of the clubs.

[GlenrothesHibee]

An extra 1000 on our home gates will more than cover the costs and its looking more than likely that will be the case with Seasons up

[Keith_M]

I have a serious objection to the title of this thread!

The word 'effect' is a noun and 'affect' is a verb; you used the wrong one. The title should have read 'How is Hearts demise going to affect Hibs?'.





Apart from that.....

It all depends what actually happens to Hearts, which is uncertain just now. If they somehow manage to carry on next season, with the extremely limited resources at their disposal, then it may have a minor positive effect on Hibs. We will surely hump them at every turn, giving a slight boost to our attendances as a result of the associated 'feel good factor'.

If they don't exist, it will adversely affect us financially in the short term but may, in fact, be good for us long term. Even if they come back in some form after this, there will only be one genuine choice for top flight football in Edinburgh. Funnily enough, that was the dream of someone associated with Hearts around 20 years ago. I can't remember the name but I'm sure it'll come back to me.

[Craig_in_Prague]

their financial doping, cheating, whatever you want to call it, has arguably cost us the chance to win a couple of cups, higher league placings etc over the last number of years.

I dont want Hibs to achieve success partly because of no Huns or Yams around, but at the end of the day, they have had no sporting integrity & get all they deserve. Hibs have achieved a lot on and off the pitch during tough economic times. We have a board that years ago decided we must stabilise the clubs finances and work on improving the infrastructure of our club. We have a top stadium and training centre and a manageable debt. Yams can laugh, but a healthy balance sheet (in any business) is important. We are in a very decent state and position to grow in the future.

Hibs can and should prosper as the capitals main / only club.

I want the mentality in our players and coaches that EVERY game is big.

Hibs need to build on what Pat is building, increase crowds, get up to 2nd place, perhaps lift a trophy, make European games a more regular thing and steadily build the club and financially become stronger and stronger = improving the player quality and yet reducing our debts.

Hibs have a serious opportunity to push on and achieve a lot, whilst doing so within our means. That is a lot more pleasurable IMO.
There is not a lot we can do about other clubs mis-management. But we CAN support the Hibees and get ER rocking each week. We don't need to just live for a few "big" games a year (which are in the main, very very poor affairs - granted more emotions etc, but for way too long the games were not even on a level playing field, so what is the point IMHO).........get singing and supporting in numbers every week.
Drive our club onwards and upwards.

[Hibs07p]

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Very minimal short term pain financially (maybe) then one team one capital city, let the fun begin!

On the theme, One city, one team, they will always wear green. Anyone passing through Edinburgh Waverley I'm reliably informed, will notice the change in colour from blue to green at certain parts of the station. Could someone please post some photos.

GGTTH

[mutley]

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An extra 1000 on our home gates will more than cover the costs and its looking more than likely that will be the case with Seasons up

We will also have extra funds coming in from Euro ties, that and if we can get a decent run in both cups that should be enough to compensate for the loss of income from home derbies.

[GordonHFC]

I have some pretty bad health issues but this is making me laugh for the first time in a long long while.

Couldn't make the 1 5 game so when they finally go tits up this will just be a figure that appears on a bit of paper every now and then, however, as a 13 year old I had the privilege of being taken to the 0 7 game by my neighbour and that memory will live with me for the rest of my life.

[Joe]

I find the idea that we are somehow going to lose out because of the demise of Hearts bizarre. Yes we will lose the Edinburgh derbies and the travelling support that Hearts bring to us, yes the current generation of Jambos will have nobody to support but supporting a football club isn’t like being part of a group that is set in stone, passed on from generation to generation. Third Lanark went bust back in the day, who do the kids and grandkids of Third Lanark fans support? Celtic, Rangers and Partick.


Supporting a football club is about sharing in a set of experiences, a collective set of memories, triumphs and tragedies. For young kids who are growing up in Edinburgh now, in ten years time when Hearts are just some football team who USED to play in Edinburgh, a ground they never went to, songs they never sung, players they never saw play, it won’t mean anything to these kids.
The reality is that Hibs, Hearts and sadly the old firm, battle each other for market share of a fan base in Edinburgh and the surrounding area. One of our main rivals is going out of business so our market share should increase.

Who will kids who’s parents aren’t football fans but themselves take an interest follow in Edinburgh? Or people who move to the area from elsewhere and want to go to a football game? Where are these people gonna go? Hibs.


I think we are gonna become the feyenoord of Scotland. Not as big as the big two but decidedly bigger than the others.

[Hibbyradge]

If Hearts die, eventually a higher percentage of kids in Edinburgh will choose to support Hibs.

[PeeJay]

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I'm enjoying the fun and games at Tynie as much as anyone, but how are the events with Hearts going to effect Hibs?

If they go pop will our crowds rise or fall? Would any Jambo's start following Hibs?

What will be the big games we as fans will look forward to, love them or hate them, the Derby is always the big game for me each season and there is no better feeling than when we beat them as per the last game at Tynie & last season's cup tie.

What will be the effect on the players if there is no Derby to look forward to, will it be good or bad?

There are so many other un-answered questions.

It's great fun just now laughing at the Hearts but when the dust settles will this be good or bad for Hibs, just wondered what everyone's thoughts are on this.

:pfgwa

Personally I am disappointed that the Scottish game in general is in such a perilous state. The situations with Rangers, Hearts are clear indicators of serious underlying problems within Scottish football: both at club level and the organisational level. While it may be enjoyable - at the moment - to a certain degree on a schadenfreude level, this decline is hardly going to be a good thing for the Scottish game if one club after the other goes to the wall. I fail to see how the problems at Ibrox and Tynecastle will ultimately be good for the game. One high revenue source has gone from the SPL, now another is in danger of going. This will surely "affect" the finances at ER and elsewhere, it will naturally impact on the television rights and revenues for clubs because the product on sale is being continously diluted. Where are the big gates going to be at ER in future? Cup runs may help, but we won't make the final every year, and I don't expect us to get far in Europe. Obviously the unfair advantages gained by these clubs has to be addressed, but I'm not convinced that there is a body in Scotland's football capable of getting this train back on the tracks. For the good of the game in Scotland in general we need "sporting integrity", a level playing field, and a footballing authority with a strong vision and purpose to take the game forward - unfortunately I don't see it.

[Sumner]

.. it's going to make me laugh more.

[Part/Time Supporter]

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If Hearts die, eventually a higher percentage of kids in Edinburgh will choose to support Hibs.

Possibly, but a greater share would become sofa-bound fans of big EPL clubs.

The analogy I would draw is that the growth of EPL is like a tide coming in on Scottish football as a whole. Rangers and Hearts stuck their heads in the sand, pretended it wasn't happening and ended up drowning.

Most of the others have retreated up the beach a bit. Yes they have survived and to some extent done well, but what prospects are there? Only a change in the overall condition (ie the tide going back out) would help overall.

[lucky]

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I find the idea that we are somehow going to lose out because of the demise of Hearts bizarre. Yes we will lose the Edinburgh derbies and the travelling support that Hearts bring to us, yes the current generation of Jambos will have nobody to support but supporting a football club isn’t like being part of a group that is set in stone, passed on from generation to generation. Third Lanark went bust back in the day, who do the kids and grandkids of Third Lanark fans support? Celtic, Rangers and Partick.


Supporting a football club is about sharing in a set of experiences, a collective set of memories, triumphs and tragedies. For young kids who are growing up in Edinburgh now, in ten years time when Hearts are just some football team who USED to play in Edinburgh, a ground they never went to, songs they never sung, players they never saw play, it won’t mean anything to these kids.
The reality is that Hibs, Hearts and sadly the old firm, battle each other for market share of a fan base in Edinburgh and the surrounding area. One of our main rivals is going out of business so our market share should increase.

Who will kids who’s parents aren’t football fans but themselves take an interest follow in Edinburgh? Or people who move to the area from elsewhere and want to go to a football game? Where are these people gonna go? Hibs.


I think we are gonna become the feyenoord of Scotland. Not as big as the big two but decidedly bigger than the others.

I just can't see a scenario where Hearts will not exist. They might get liquidated but will remerge in some other form.

[basehibby]

I think we will take a small hit as a result of losing the Derbies, however, the overall trend in attendances at ER has F'all to do with Hearts (or Rangers for that matter) and everything to do with how Hibs perform on the pitch.

If the team play attractive winning football the crowds will come - Simples!

[Matty_Jack04]

I don't think hibs will benefit from gaining extra fans directly from hearts going pop, if they do liquidate they will form a newco and those fans that follow hearts now, will rally behind that at least for the first few seasons anyway then they will drop off to armchair fans until they reach the top league again, what hibs will benefit hugely from is the amount of young players to choose from rather than fighting for the best around Edinburgh with hearts, hibs will have a lot more to offer (SPL football,training facillities, even full time status maybe?) therefore securing the best young talent.

we need to continue to build though, we should be fighting it out for 2nd place next year on paper but we have found ourselves behind the likes of Motherwell and ICT who have managed to get a good stable few years of building whilst we have made a hash of things for various reasons (management being the main)

we will miss the gates but we managed to budget for the loss of the rangers we will just need to do the same again and hope that we can maybe bring back more fans who have stayed away with good results and performances to push is on a bit more, the atmosphere and support at ER is much better now than in previous years the booing and jeering has gone and replaced by the likes of sect 43 which does make the match experience a lot more enjoyable, lowering ticket prices is becoming more and more difficult because of loosing the big gates so its down to the team to perform to get punters through the door again

[joe breezy]

I lived in Gorgie when I was very young and I went to school in Gorgie.

I don't mind Gorgie as a place, it's more homely to me than Leith because some of my first memories are there. I feel sorry for the small businesses that will suffer.

I hate supermarket culture where small businesses are squeezed out because of Tesco, Asda etc and Hearts leaving Gorgie will harm businesses.

This obviously isn't directly linked to Hibs other than the Gorgie Greens but on the whole Edinburgh will be a better place without Hearts. It all depends what gets built at Tynecastle I suppose.

With regards to Hibs there are lots of cities of Edinburgh's size with just one team. Wallace Mercer was right that Edinburgh should just have one team. Amsterdam just has one team and it's much bigger than Edinburgh so the idea that a city with half a million people needs two teams is just ridiculous.

Hibs will be more successful without the need for them although we do have to do better in Europe. European success will be essential not a luxury. That means group stages of Europa League at least.

It's good for Scottish society that it's the bigots that are going out of business. last Hearts game i was at heard loads of fenian bas** songs and archaic sectarian vitriol.

[Keith_M]

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Personally I am disappointed that the Scottish game in general is in such a perilous state. The situations with Rangers, Hearts are clear indicators of serious underlying problems within Scottish football: both at club level and the organisational level. While it may be enjoyable - at the moment - to a certain degree on a schadenfreude level, this decline is hardly going to be a good thing for the Scottish game if one club after the other goes to the wall. I fail to see how the problems at Ibrox and Tynecastle will ultimately be good for the game. One high revenue source has gone from the SPL, now another is in danger of going. This will surely "affect" the finances at ER and elsewhere, it will naturally impact on the television rights and revenues for clubs because the product on sale is being continously diluted. Where are the big gates going to be at ER in future? Cup runs may help, but we won't make the final every year, and I don't expect us to get far in Europe. Obviously the unfair advantages gained by these clubs has to be addressed, but I'm not convinced that there is a body in Scotland's football capable of getting this train back on the tracks. For the good of the game in Scotland in general we need "sporting integrity", a level playing field, and a footballing authority with a strong vision and purpose to take the game forward - unfortunately I don't see it.

Rangers will be back in the top league in 2 years, so that's not a problem. As for the underlying problem with Scottish Football, I agree to an extent but don't think you can really say that what has happened at Hearts is symptomatic of Scottish clubs in General. They really are a special case with the ridiculous level of their spending. No other club has come anywhere near spending over 100% of their income on salary for 7 successive years.

I think this is actually now an opportunity as opposed to the endgame for Scottish Football. Clubs have clearly seen what happens when you're reckless with your finances and I'd be amazed if anyone is now stupid enough to follow that path. If they do, then hell mend them. Clubs might now decide to live within their means, meaning teams like Hearts will no longer be poaching players from other clubs at unsustainable wages. This means that clubs will find their natural place in the order and the league could be fairer as a result.

[Keith_M]

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..... the idea that a city with half a million people needs two teams is just ridiculous.

Liverpool and Everton.
- Population of Liverpool = 465,000

[basehibby]

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Personally I am disappointed that the Scottish game in general is in such a perilous state. The situations with Rangers, Hearts are clear indicators of serious underlying problems within Scottish football: both at club level and the organisational level. While it may be enjoyable - at the moment - to a certain degree on a schadenfreude level, this decline is hardly going to be a good thing for the Scottish game if one club after the other goes to the wall. I fail to see how the problems at Ibrox and Tynecastle will ultimately be good for the game. One high revenue source has gone from the SPL, now another is in danger of going. This will surely "affect" the finances at ER and elsewhere, it will naturally impact on the television rights and revenues for clubs because the product on sale is being continously diluted. Where are the big gates going to be at ER in future? Cup runs may help, but we won't make the final every year, and I don't expect us to get far in Europe. Obviously the unfair advantages gained by these clubs has to be addressed, but I'm not convinced that there is a body in Scotland's football capable of getting this train back on the tracks. For the good of the game in Scotland in general we need "sporting integrity", a level playing field, and a footballing authority with a strong vision and purpose to take the game forward - unfortunately I don't see it.

I disagree - or partly at least - what's happened to Rangers and Hearts is justice and entirely the fault of the idiots in charge at these clubs and their vain-glorious attempts to gain glory they had not truly earned as institutions, regardless of the consequences.

Their effect on the rest of Scottish football has been to add pressure to all the other clubs to keep up with their insane levels of spending, thus pushing other clubs closer to the brink of disaster than they might have been.

The disasters that Rangers and Hearts have finally brought upon themselves will hopefully lead to something of a restoration of sanity in the Scottish game and that has got to be a good thing. Of course that will be offset by a loss of revenue deriving from the loss of their supports as you have pointed out, but the positives deriving from their downfalls should not be ignored.

[JeMeSouviens]

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Personally I am disappointed that the Scottish game in general is in such a perilous state. The situations with Rangers, Hearts are clear indicators of serious underlying problems within Scottish football: both at club level and the organisational level. While it may be enjoyable - at the moment - to a certain degree on a schadenfreude level, this decline is hardly going to be a good thing for the Scottish game if one club after the other goes to the wall. I fail to see how the problems at Ibrox and Tynecastle will ultimately be good for the game. One high revenue source has gone from the SPL, now another is in danger of going. This will surely "affect" the finances at ER and elsewhere, it will naturally impact on the television rights and revenues for clubs because the product on sale is being continously diluted. Where are the big gates going to be at ER in future? Cup runs may help, but we won't make the final every year, and I don't expect us to get far in Europe. Obviously the unfair advantages gained by these clubs has to be addressed, but I'm not convinced that there is a body in Scotland's football capable of getting this train back on the tracks. For the good of the game in Scotland in general we need "sporting integrity", a level playing field, and a footballing authority with a strong vision and purpose to take the game forward - unfortunately I don't see it.

I think to put Scottish football on the right path we first need to cleanse our Augean stables, something the SFA has so far completely failed to grasp. There isn't a carpet massive enough to hide 30 years' worth of dung! Once the filth has been washed out, the opportunity definitely exists for our "governing" body to actually implement some governance. Which would be nice.

[southsider]

Most of us are pig sick of their "we didny ken" attitude and let them lie in their own stink. Now i think it is up to us who are in a possision to do a wee bit more to help cover the shortfall do so. I was going to get 2 K for K st's now i shatt get 4. "Every little helps". GGTTH

[Ringothedog]

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Liverpool and Everton.
- Population of Liverpool = 465,000

Merseyside poulation 1.4m
Lothians 850k

there is no comparison, the difference is bigger than the population of Edinburgh

[Part/Time Supporter]

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I think to put Scottish football on the right path we first need to cleanse our Augean stables, something the SFA has so far completely failed to grasp. There isn't a carpet massive enough to hide 30 years' worth of dung! Once the filth has been washed out, the opportunity definitely exists for our "governing" body to actually implement some governance. Which would be nice.

Unless either the economic circumstances of Scottish football miraculously change or proper regulation is put in place, the same things are just going to happen again. Not necessarily with the same clubs.

[spike220]

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Rangers will be back in the top league in 2 years, so that's not a problem. As for the underlying problem with Scottish Football, I agree to an extent but don't think you can really say that what has happened at Hearts is symptomatic of Scottish clubs in General. They really are a special case with the ridiculous level of their spending. No other club has come anywhere near spending over 100% of their income on salary for 7 successive years.

I think this is actually now an opportunity as opposed to the endgame for Scottish Football. Clubs have clearly seen what happens when you're reckless with your finances and I'd be amazed if anyone is now stupid enough to follow that path. If they do, then hell mend them. Clubs might now decide to live within their means, meaning teams like Hearts will no longer be poaching players from other clubs at unsustainable wages. This means that clubs will find their natural place in the order and the league could be fairer as a result.

I think what you mean to say was: 'The Rangers' for the first time in their short history will be playing in the top league in 2 years and bring with them the remaining fans of the old Rangers club who now have nobody else to follow, so that's not a problem. .....................

[Waxy]

Affect? Well after all the parties n stuff the excitement will die down after a couple of years. All the jambos will start to age and die and without any fresh new jambos they should completely vanish in around 60 years time. All jambos kids/ grandkids will be split between Hibs and Spartans. A much better non cheating Edinburgh rivalry.

[CRAZYHIBBY]

A few jambos at work reckon they will ground share with hibs if they lose their stadium............surely petrie wouldnt be so stupid

[joe breezy]

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Liverpool and Everton.
- Population of Liverpool = 465,000

'need' was the word I used

Leeds and Newcastle (Tyneside) don't need 2 teams in the one city

Population of Leeds 750 000
Population of Tyneside 880 000