Generic Sevco / Rangers meltdown thread

***Stonewall*** · 04-11-2017 08:44 AM

Originally Posted by wookie70

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At some point the money will run out and we will have to decide if The The Rangers can be let back in again without penalty

https://stv.tv/sport/football/140149...st-free-loans/

New Oasis guaranteeing to provide loans but King's lawyers stated in court that he had no control over their assets. Also no undertaking to provide further loans from the other directors.

Interesting.

**Velma Dinkley** · 04-11-2017 08:45 AM

I don't understand anything that John James guy writes.

***Bostonhibby*** · 04-11-2017 08:48 AM

Originally Posted by Stonewall

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New Oasis guaranteeing to provide loans but King's lawyers stated in court that he had no control over their assets. Also no undertaking to provide further loans from the other directors.

Interesting.

As long as governments turn a blind eye (whilst spouting indignantly about them) to the tax dodging and criminality of off shore trusts and similar this problem will always go on, sadly.

It is nice of this seemingly random business just to choose by complete chance to give this money to sevco, makes you wonder if its Vladimir Romanov and it's somebody else's money Oasis have been playing at sevco with.

***grunt*** · 04-11-2017 08:49 AM

Originally Posted by Cilla Black

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I don't understand anything that John James guy writes.

Ha! You and me both.

***Billy Whizz*** · 04-11-2017 08:50 AM

Wonder if these figures will have a bearing on McInnes decision

**~~southsider~~** · 04-11-2017 09:16 AM

Originally Posted by Stonewall

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New Oasis guaranteeing to provide loans but King's lawyers stated in court that he had no control over their assets. Also no undertaking to provide further loans from the other directors.

Interesting.

Did King's lawyers also claim he was skint and could not afford to buy all the shares, as ordered by the court, but can give Goven FC interest free loans ? Taking the p*ss me thinks.

**Kavinho** · 04-11-2017 09:22 AM

Originally Posted by Eyrie

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They won't be allowed back in, but following precedent The The Rangers will take their place.

Question - will we call the next club based at Ibrox The The Rangers, The Sevco or just Huns?

3rd Rangers.

Straight to the point and ensure its never forgotten. Plus its got a nice historical nod to that other defunct Glasgow club.

***Stonewall*** · 04-11-2017 10:10 AM

Originally Posted by Billy Whizz

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Wonder if these figures will have a bearing on McInnes decision

Has McInnes even been approached?

My money's on Murty (Only 20p though).

**Ozyhibby** · 04-11-2017 10:13 AM

Sevco’s losses by season:
2012/13 -£14m
2013/14 - £8.1m
2014/15 - £7.5m
2015/16 - £3.3m
2016/17 - £6.7m

Total for last five years - £39.6m

Anyone know why UEFA FFP rules appear not to affect them?

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***Stonewall*** · 04-11-2017 10:14 AM

Originally Posted by southsider

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Did King's lawyers also claim he was skint and could not afford to buy all the shares, as ordered by the court, but can give Goven FC interest free loans ? Taking the p*ss me thinks.

I think so.

**Fuzzywuzzy** · 04-11-2017 10:35 AM

Originally Posted by southsider

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Did King's lawyers also claim he was skint and could not afford to buy all the shares, as ordered by the court, but can give Goven FC interest free loans ? Taking the p*ss me thinks.

Also forgetting that they have nearly £1m (allegedly) to take McInnes from aberdeen

***CropleyWasGod*** · 04-11-2017 10:40 AM

Originally Posted by southsider

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Did King's lawyers also claim he was skint and could not afford to buy all the shares, as ordered by the court, but can give Goven FC interest free loans ? Taking the p*ss me thinks.

The defence is that Oasis is not controlled by him. It's a family trust that is not at his disposal.

It's entirely feasible that he, personally, can be asset-rich but penny-skint. The obvious solution would be to realise some of his assets to pay for the shares, but I'm not sure if the Court have the power to order that.

(By the way, the Court haven't made up their mind on the shares question yet)

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**~~Tornadoes70~~** · 04-11-2017 10:48 AM

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

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The defence is that Oasis is not controlled by him. It's a family trust that is not at his disposal.

It's entirely feasible that he, personally, can be asset-rich but penny-skint. The obvious solution would be to realise some of his assets to pay for the shares, but I'm not sure if the Court have the power to order that.

(By the way, the Court haven't made up their mind on the shares question yet)

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Its irrelevant how much he has, doesn't have or has no control over really. He's been found guilty of acting in concert by the TOP and being in clear breach of the normal rules and shouldn't have a leg to stand on so to speak. The Court should order him to make good on the share offer irrespective of his pleading poverty. It'll be very interesting to see which way this goes and read Lord Bannatyne's judgment.

Lets hope the gasl is held to account.

GGTTH

***Eyrie*** · 04-11-2017 10:51 AM

Originally Posted by Bostonhibby

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The team formerly known as the team that replaced the now defunct Glasgow rangers?

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Originally Posted by Hibernia&Alba

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Rangers the Third. It's rhyming slang tae.

Originally Posted by Bostonhibby

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The Loan rangers.

Originally Posted by Kavinho

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3rd Rangers.

Straight to the point and ensure its never forgotten. Plus its got a nice historical nod to that other defunct Glasgow club.

An excellent selection of nominations and the winner is ..... (opens envelope) ..... 3rd Rangers!

**Springbank** · 04-11-2017 11:02 AM

On page 1320 id like to make a reference to the 1320 Declaration of Arbroath.

Dear Mr King
It is in truth not for glory, nor riches, nor honours that we are fighting, but for freedom - for that alone, which no honest man gives up but with life itself

But while we are on, thanks for gifting us the glory back on 21 May 2016

***jacomo*** · 04-11-2017 11:13 AM

Will they never, ever learn?

I wonder if Alastair Johnston rejoined the board to try and find a new buyer?

**seanshow** · 04-11-2017 11:17 AM

Ach it be fine this time, they are using the yamenomic logic of ''we owe the money to ourselves''

If the hun go t**s up a second time it would be hilarious.

***CropleyWasGod*** · 04-11-2017 11:26 AM

Originally Posted by lgnsh70

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Its irrelevant how much he has, doesn't have or has no control over really. He's been found guilty of acting in concert by the TOP and being in clear breach of the normal rules and shouldn't have a leg to stand on so to speak. The Court should order him to make good on the share offer irrespective of his pleading poverty. It'll be very interesting to see which way this goes and read Lord Bannatyne's judgment.

Lets hope the gasl is held to account.

GGTTH

Yup...that was an irrelevance in the Court case IMO.

If the COS uphold the TP's judgement, and DK can't comply, it probably becomes a criminal matter.

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**~~Tornadoes70~~** · 04-11-2017 11:41 AM

Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

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Yup...that was an irrelevance in the Court case IMO.

If the COS uphold the TP's judgement, and DK can't comply, it probably becomes a criminal matter.

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Absolutely.

it seemed bizarre to plead poverty at this stage as normally it would be used at the later stage mitigation if non compliance occurred. The gasl appears to be at the outer limits of stretching a Courts tolerance levels with his mendacity. I'm sure its not escaped the Lords who are some of the most sharply focused and highly intelligent minds in the country who should come to the correct outcome of ordering him to make good the share offer.

**hibsbollah** · 04-11-2017 11:52 AM

According to one of the Sportsound goons the hun have spent £10million on players in the summer, not including wages. So it's not difficult to analyse why and from where the £6.7million loss reported today comes from. It's evidence of a pathological inability to behave like a normal business. Live within their means, promote youth players and focus on quality coaching and they actually have a good business model with the levels of income they have. Shame they're too stupid to follow it

**Smartie** · 04-11-2017 12:11 PM

Originally Posted by hibsbollah

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According to one of the Sportsound goons the hun have spent £10million on players in the summer, not including wages. So it's not difficult to analyse why and from where the £6.7million loss reported today comes from. It's evidence of a pathological inability to behave like a normal business. Live within their means, promote youth players and focus on quality coaching and they actually have a good business model with the levels of income they have. Shame they're too stupid to follow it

The problem they have is that if they actually lived within their means then their attendances and income stream would drop off.

I'm genuinely unconvinced that the "entity known as Rangers" in whatever form is actually viable. They need to spend more than they earn to attract the big crowds. Nobody is prepared to plough in the difference to keep them viable long-term, and they exist from short-term loan to short-term loan. If they shrink what they spend, they will shrink what they earn by more.

Every club appears to be able to cut their cloth accordingly, apart from them. (And I would grudgingly throw our chums across the city into this bracket. They had their generation of over-spending, but what they are managing to do with their donations to keep the club going whilst they build that much-needed new stand is deserving of the tiniest bit of acknowledgment in my book).

I genuinely believe they have a second "insolvency event" coming to them, possibly not imminently, but when it does happen, they will find it very hard to emerge from it.

**Ozyhibby** · 04-11-2017 12:14 PM

Originally Posted by hibsbollah

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According to one of the Sportsound goons the hun have spent £10million on players in the summer, not including wages. So it's not difficult to analyse why and from where the £6.7million loss reported today comes from. It's evidence of a pathological inability to behave like a normal business. Live within their means, promote youth players and focus on quality coaching and they actually have a good business model with the levels of income they have. Shame they're too stupid to follow it

The players they bought in the summer are not included in these accounts. That will be next years losses.

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**Is It On....** · 04-11-2017 02:01 PM

Originally Posted by Smartie

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The problem they have is that if they actually lived within their means then their attendances and income stream would drop off.

I'm genuinely unconvinced that the "entity known as Rangers" in whatever form is actually viable. They need to spend more than they earn to attract the big crowds. Nobody is prepared to plough in the difference to keep them viable long-term, and they exist from short-term loan to short-term loan. If they shrink what they spend, they will shrink what they earn by more.

Every club appears to be able to cut their cloth accordingly, apart from them. (And I would grudgingly throw our chums across the city into this bracket. They had their generation of over-spending, but what they are managing to do with their donations to keep the club going whilst they build that much-needed new stand is deserving of the tiniest bit of acknowledgment in my book).

I genuinely believe they have a second "insolvency event" coming to them, possibly not imminently, but when it does happen, they will find it very hard to emerge from it.

It sort of goes back to much maligned Fergus McCann. He created the foundations with the 60,000 all seater stadium which is about 10,000 more than Ibrox. Simplistically, this creates a potential revenue gap of £5m - £6m per season. It was hidden during the EBT years but is what they are now struggling with now and they need great luck in the transfer market, a great manager and / or a poor Celtic manager to realistically compete. Living within your means after years of "creative financing" makes for some uncomfortable helpings of reality, a process our neighbours are also finding difficult to deal with.

**hibsbollah** · 04-11-2017 02:09 PM

Originally Posted by Ozyhibby

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The players they bought in the summer are not included in these accounts. That will be next years losses.

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So it's worse than that! Excellent

***Kaiser1962*** · 04-11-2017 02:16 PM

The major concern that I see is that The Rangers wages as a proportion of turnover is pretty much ideal at 60%. This was always the case (generally) with Old Rangers who were paying their players other ways, but I notice it is still the case. It's not really a concern as such from here, but you know what I mean.

As for finding a buyer they would have to clear of the loans which appear to growing each season with the club failing to trouble Celtic which they have to do to accumulate from their speculation. In reality they are not even close.

**HUTCHYHIBBY** · 04-11-2017 03:21 PM

As long as Celtic continue to qualify for the group stage of the CL they won't be losing much sleep about whatever goes on at Ibrox.

**Iain G** · 06-11-2017 09:21 AM

Steve McClaren being linked to the managers position now...

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/m...gers-9xc27fgwr

***Bostonhibby*** · 06-11-2017 09:26 AM

Originally Posted by Iain G

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Steve McClaren being linked to the managers position now...

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/m...gers-9xc27fgwr

Excellent if true we've not really got over the loss of Pedro or father dougal so fair play to sevco if they fill the comic book figure role in Scottish football so quickly.

Another one who'll be expensive to get rid off after half a season as well so everyone's a winner.

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