Yam Manager

[ALF TUPPER]

Yeah ........... agree! Though the jambo manager came across very well. Obvioulsy the wrong appointment and wont last IMO


( ps.......Still smiling from my wee visit to Dunfermline on Saturday - even bought the papers on Sunday !)


Glory Glory

[Lago]

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I'm still trying to work out what a "rivality" is.

And was there any need for the massive rant about how Hearts and Hibs aren't "enemies" and he doesn't have enemies in football.

It was obviously a figure of speech from MacLean!

Rubbish,
1) wasn't a rant at all, very controlled
2) his comments about not hating anyone or club was correct, as he explained its a GAME not war.

[Lucius Apuleius]

He impressed me. I was also ready for a rant at him but could find nothing substantial enough to get my knickers in a twist.

[SaulGoodman]

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He impressed me. I was also ready for a rant at him but could find nothing substantial enough to get my knickers in a twist.

His tie didn't go well with his suit, he sat too far back in his seat and didn't make enough eye contact. Jambo fud.

[Mon Dieu4]

Thought he came over well and seems like a decent bloke, however he still has no eyebrows and I dont like that one bit!!!

[Sir David Gray]

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I suspect he is more "completely fluent" in English than a good number of the local thick and borderline illiterate football pundits employed in Scotland

Wouldn't necessarily disagree with that. There are a lot of Scottish people employed on television and radio who should be nowhere near a media related job as they are completely illiterate.

However, that wasn't really my point.

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WTF that's it then, each and every foreign manager or player who are asked to be interviewed after a game should really consider whether their English is fluent enough before they accept!

Not quite the same thing.

You're talking about a manager/player conducting a 2 minute post match interview on radio/TV and I'm talking about someone being the main guest on the country's highlights show for 45 minutes or whatever it was.

Slight difference there, I would suggest.

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Dear oh dear. That is embarrassing. "Foreigners"?! What world are you living in? An imaginary Daily Mail-inspired paradise?

GG

I'm sorry, I take it "foreigner" is another word that the political correctness gang have decided to ban from public usage?

for·eign·er (fôr-nr, fr-)
n.
1. One who is from a foreign country or place.

Not too sure how anyone can seriously have a problem with someone from Portugal being described as a "foreigner"! It actually beggars belief!

Which word is now the acceptable phrase to use here? It's just that these things change so often that I can't keep up and I really want to make sure that I get it right in the future!

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Spot on. I don't think we should let in any of those Johnny Foreigner types until they pass an advanced test (written and verbal) on English grammar, tense and pronunciation (with a mark of 100%).

That's my holiday to Spain goosed though, unless the entire Spanish language is "Dos Coca-Colas".

HOLIDAY to Spain
WORKING in Britain

Spot the difference.

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If it was a 'figure of speech' from MacLean, it was one he should eject from his vocabulary right now.

Football's a game. Talking about 'enemies' is grossly irresponsible when you're the front man on a national TV's football highlights program. As if we don't have enough problems with football fans going to war over the OF games, now this numpty has to try to stir it up between the Edinburgh clubs. It's MacLean who should be hauled over the coals, not Sergio.

I'm old enough to remember the time when Hibs and Hearts fans went to derbies together, and stood together in unsegregated crowds without attacking one another, and then went off to the pub together afterwards. All that ended when Mercer came along, and I for one consider that that's one of the worst aspects of Mercer's effect on football in the capital.

As I understand it, Sergio has been learning to speak English really only since he came to Edinburgh. Seems to me he's doing OK.

Also he wasn't 'ranting'. MacLean (who should be a lot more aware of the implications of what he says on camera in his native language than he is) alleged that Hibs and Hearts were 'enemies'. Sadly, a lot of the fans these days see the other side as enemies, and this isn't helped by things media 'pundits' like Preston and Robertson and Hearts 'spokesmen' have come out with over the past few years. No wonder intelligent pundits like Pat Nevin tend to move on from BBC Scotland as quickly as the possibly can.

We get left with the likes of Billy Dodds and John Hughes.

Sergio quite reasonably and commendably clearly (since he was answering in a language foreign to him) made it very clear that while he considered Hibs to be the number one rivals of his own club, he saw no need to talk about 'enmity' and that he himself did not consider Hibs, or the Hibs players, or Pat Fenlon, his 'enemies'. The fact that he referred to Pat by his first name was refreshing to say the least. That sounded like one professional speaking with respect about another professional colleague, which is how it should be, IMO.

He came over to me as a decent guy - much more gracious and level-headed than Jefferies or Levein, to name but two.

I know you're not agreeing with me but thanks for your reply. It was well constructed, clearly thought out and you debated the points in a mature and adult manner.

[Viva_Palmeiras]

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Any need for that at all?

I was under the impression that personal abuse was frowned upon on here?

By all means debate the subject but without coming out with stuff like that.



Wouldn't necessarily disagree with that. There are a lot of Scottish people employed on television and radio who should be nowhere near a media related job as they are completely illiterate.

However, that wasn't really my point.



Not quite the same thing.

You're talking about a manager/player conducting a 2 minute post match interview on radio/TV and I'm talking about someone being the main guest on the country's highlights show for 45 minutes or whatever it was.

Slight difference there, I would suggest.



I'm sorry, I take it "foreigner" is another word that the political correctness gang have decided to ban from public usage?

for·eign·er (fôr-nr, fr-)
n.
1. One who is from a foreign country or place.

Not too sure how anyone can seriously have a problem with someone from Portugal being described as a "foreigner"! It actually beggars belief!

Which word is now the acceptable phrase to use here? It's just that these things change so often that I can't keep up and I really want to make sure that I get it right in the future!



HOLIDAY to Spain
WORKING in Britain

Spot the difference.



I know you're not agreeing with me but thanks for your reply. It was well constructed, clearly thought out and you debated the points in a mature and adult manner.

I believe the phrase is quando voce esta dentro na borracha, para escavar ;)
Bit since I done speak fluent Portuguese I probably got the tenses wrong ;)

I'm glad that with budget travel, the Internet, communications the worlds become a smaller place. Opens minds hopefully. Afterall where would british comedy be without a few mispronounced worlds?

[SRHibs]

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Fixed that for you

Sorry for the pedantry, but I was instructed not to say 'por favor' when purchasing things in Spain. Not sure if it is correct to do so though.

[lapsedhibee]

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I'm sorry, I take it "foreigner" is another word that the political correctness gang have decided to ban from public usage?

for·eign·er (fôr-nr, fr-)
n.
1. One who is from a foreign country or place.

Not too sure how anyone can seriously have a problem with someone from Portugal being described as a "foreigner"! It actually beggars belief!

Which word is now the acceptable phrase to use here? It's just that these things change so often that I can't keep up and I really want to make sure that I get it right in the future!

Refugee.

[Beefster]

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HOLIDAY to Spain
WORKING in Britain

Spot the difference.

Phew, my holiday to Spain is still on.

We still shouldn't let those Johnny Foreigner types into Scotland if they can't speak perfect English. Even if they're let in, let's deport them if they make any mistakes whilst speaking.

Incidentally, from personal experience I know that there are some foreign academics in Scotland, making huge contributions to their area of research, who sometimes make a gramatical, pronunciation and/or tense error whilst lecturing/speaking. Let's ship the *******s out before they do some real damage.

[Jack]

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Sorry for the pedantry, but I was instructed not to say 'por favor' when purchasing things in Spain. Not sure if it is correct to do so though.

Well I do it, as much out of habit I suppose and it's always well received. Johnny Foreigner does like it when you make a bit of effort. :-)

I don't think it's wrong, just uncommon - almost like manners have become in this country :-(

[hibbymac]

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Phew, my holiday to Spain is still on.

We still shouldn't let those Johnny Foreigner types into Scotland if they can't speak perfect English. Even if they're let in, let's deport them if they make any mistakes whilst speaking.

Incidentally, from personal experience I know that there are some foreign academics in Scotland, making huge contributions to their area of research, who sometimes make a gramatical, pronunciation and/or tense error whilst lecturing/speaking. Let's ship the *******s out before they do some real damage.

Get these kinds out, more jobs (especially on the Telly) for people who can speak flewant England.

[The Green Goblin]

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I'm sorry, I take it "foreigner" is another word that the political correctness gang have decided to ban from public usage?

for·eign·er (fôr-nr, fr-)
n.
1. One who is from a foreign country or place.

Not too sure how anyone can seriously have a problem with someone from Portugal being described as a "foreigner"! It actually beggars belief!

Which word is now the acceptable phrase to use here? It's just that these things change so often that I can't keep up and I really want to make sure that I get it right in the future!

Thank you. I would have replied sooner, but have been out of internet range for the last few days.

Tell me, how do people who are 2nd/3rd generation and of mixed nationality/ethnicity/parentage fit in to your perfect definition? e.g. Is someone born in Scotland to Chinese parents, but who grows up in Scotland and speaks flawed English with a Scottish accent a 'foreigner'? hmmmm.

Who exactly are the "political correctness gang"? And none of this "beggars belief". Please. What a lot of over the top nonsense. You have clearly misrepresented my point, and why I didn't care for what you wrote, but I suspect you know that full well. However, I will be happy to clarify it now.

There's nothing wrong with the word "foreigner" itself, obviously, but as with many words, how you choose to use it and the context of it can make the word carry slightly different meanings. In this case, you wrote "I've got no problems at all with foreigners being on television, as long as their command of the English language is completely fluent..."

Apart from your definition of the word being deeply flawed and unusable, as I started with, it's also all about what your sentence implies rather than actually says. Why, for example, would you have problems with foreigners being on television? Your sentence, and use of the word, suggests, or more specifically, gives away the fact that you believe that certain reasons might or do exist for foreigners on tv being a problem in some way. Might it be because they are foreigners?

On a basic level, what you wrote also betrays your "them and us" attitude, with "them" needing to prove their worth compared to "us", e.g. that they are only acceptable if they speak "completely fluent" English..

There's more, but that's the main bit of it.

In our very multicultural society, I really find this idea, this way of thinking that we still live in a world where there's "us" and "foreigners" really archaic and frankly, obsolete. Scotland is full of many different nationalities, and many families, as I said, have given birth to a 2nd, 3rd and more generation of people who are part of our society and who can't be said to have a clear single nationality that someone like you can label them with or put them in the right little box. I can understand why there being shades of gray here gives you problems, with your traditionally inflexible and black and white view of many things, but for your information, Scotland is not full of Scots, and France does not contain only French people. The world isn't like that; it's all a great big messy mix-up.

As I said on another thread recently, I really just wish people would stop feeling the need to evaluate others based on nationality/ethnicity/religion and just see people as people full stop. That, I suppose, is ultimately the problem I have with the implication and underlying meaning in what you wrote and your use of the word.

GG