Protest before game on Sunday.

[Septimus]

I predict that the protesters will be looking decidedly "sheepish" after the game. We are going to win.

[SouthamptonHibs]

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Well you're at it lads, can you complain about my pie at the Berwick game being a wee bit burnt? ****** sake.

So some tube reckons we should protest against a manager who has literally just signed all the players he wants, is still out looking for more at the expense of our captain's testimonial, some of whom aren't 100% fit yet, 5 games into a new season, just after a transfer window's closed. Genius. Truly genius.

Presumably the numpty who decided to set this up is the kind of "Fan" who expects instant success on the park at all times, regardless.

Not sure you can call the guy a numpty (ps i've no idea who he is) but what manager signs unfit players and plays up to 6 "not match fit players" in a derby match!
Now thats a numpty!
Fans are entitled to protest, CC is brutal, he has had loads of time to prepare a team for this season!
One of his many shocking statements was a few weeks back before the Celtic game when he said that Hibs aren't ready for the new season! Surely thats a sackable offence! The start of the season date has been out for months, Who's fauts that? Yes CC's!
The guy has no commitment to Hibs and his signings look to be gash!
His record speaks for himself. At worst a coaches job is to get a team fit and play to a game plan! Or team looks unfit and un-organised.
Fans have a right to protest!

Hail Hail

[marinello59]

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Not sure you can call the guy a numpty (ps i've no idea who he is) but what manager signs unfit players and plays up to 6 "not match fit players" in a derby match!
Now thats a numpty!
Fans are entitled to protest, CC is brutal, his had loads of time to prepare a team for the this season!
One of his many shocking statements was a few weeks back before the Celtic game when he said that Hibs aren't ready for the new season! Surely thats a sackable offence! The start of the season date has been out for months, Who's fauts that? Yes CC's!
The guy has no commitment to Hibs and his signings look to be gash!
His record speaks for himself. At worst a coaches job is to get a team fit and play to a game plan! Or team looks unfit and un-organised.
Fans have a right to protest!

Hail Hail

Yeap, they do.
Why before the match though when it will affect the players? After the match?..........if that's what people want to do it's up to them.

[SouthamptonHibs]

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Yeap, they do.
Why before the match though when it will affect the players? After the match?..........if that's what people want to do it's up to them.

Good point, timing of these things are always difficult as there's plus points to both!

I agree and say it's better to protest after the game, even if we win 3pts on Sun it won't make much of a difference to the fans if you are at the point your ready to protest.
In some cases it's good to protest before they game as it might be the kick up the @rse that everyone needs to go out and start getting results

[3pm]

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Yeap, they do.
Why before the match though when it will affect the players? After the match?..........if that's what people want to do it's up to them.

Why are you so sure it will affect the players?

[sunshine1875]

Zut Alors! Well I'm definately revolting!










I am joking!

[IWasThere2016]

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A naughty Yam did it and ran away.

Mark Donald(son) LTYF!

[marinello59]

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Why are you so sure it will affect the players?

I don't know for sure but it is a possibility isn't it? Hopefully it won't.
But wouldn't it be fair to assume that it will provide a certain amount of distraction from the task in hand?

[3pm]

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I don't know for sure but it is a possibility isn't it? Hopefully it won't.
But wouldn't it be fair to assume that it will provide a certain amount of distraction from the task in hand?

I personally wouldn't make that assumption but I don't have all the facts to hand to say one way or another. If I was guessing, I'd say it wouldn't affect them. They are usually in the dressing room from 1.40ish so I don't think they'll be that aware.

Also, it doesn't seem to affect them when the atmosphere is good, bad or indifferent - we don't seem to perform that well. I am not sure a minor protest would really affect performance levels.

And above all, do they really care?

[matty_f]

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I personally wouldn't make that assumption but I don't have all the facts to hand to say one way or another. If I was guessing, I'd say it wouldn't affect them. They are usually in the dressing room from 1.40ish so I don't think they'll be that aware.

Also, it doesn't seem to affect them when the atmosphere is good, bad or indifferent - we don't seem to perform that well. I am not sure a minor protest would really affect performance levels.

And above all, do they really care?

I think a good atmosphere does affect them - when we beat St Mirren last season under the floodlights in the midweek, must-win game, the atmosphere was brilliant (I'm not talking about songs going for 90 minutes, I'm talking about a buzz around the ground, and a huge sense of the fans getting right behind the team and willing them to win) and the players responded, chasing everything down, flying into tackles, bursting a gut for the cause and lifted the performance accordingly.

I really hope we can get a similar atmosphere come Sunday, as I definitely think we are better when the crowd is up for it.

[3pm]

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I think a good atmosphere does affect them - when we beat St Mirren last season under the floodlights in the midweek, must-win game, the atmosphere was brilliant (I'm not talking about songs going for 90 minutes, I'm talking about a buzz around the ground, and a huge sense of the fans getting right behind the team and willing them to win) and the players responded, chasing everything down, flying into tackles, bursting a gut for the cause and lifted the performance accordingly.

I really hope we can get a similar atmosphere come Sunday, as I definitely think we are better when the crowd is up for it.

I'd normally agree Matty but we were 2nd to a high proportion of balls at the PBSy. I am now of the mindset that if we struggle to get up for that, how will we manage against anyone else?

[Stevie Reid]

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The above does not answer any of the questions that I asked.

I asked you;

1. Where did i say that 'managers can only be judged on their own teams'. - you have not shown the the quote, please do.
I did say that "I" was not going to judge him on the team he took over. I did not expect him to change things overnight, making players better and results better by looking at them, my view. Again show me where I say that 'manager can only be judged on their own team'.

2. Where did I say that the only games that count for me are the 5 wins - you have again not shown me that.
I did say that following signings in January we made signings and due to a run of games removed ourselves from relegation threat which was a worry for many. I did not say those were the only games that counted, and simply put that is a fact.

3. I would suggest the mistakes in the St Mirren game was the equivilent of throwing away points, would you not agree with that. I would also say I am not singling out booth, I have stated on many threads I think he could be a good player, but he, like all youngsters is having a dip in form. My most recent comment in relation to booth was on the proposed team for Aberdeen.

4. Where did I imply that calderwood is only being judged on wins and its the teams fault if we loose? I have said nothing of the sort, I did state the importance of tomorrow, a reflection perhaps of the season before, in addition I said if we lose I was not going to have one at the whole situation.


I gave my view on the situation. to be blunt I said it when yogi was in charge I dont care about results which bridge over two seasons, and I dont care now. Palsson was equally as at fault for the silly mistakes in the St Mirren game, please excuse me for not providing a full analysis.

My post was based on how I am assessing Calderwood in terms of what he has done for the team and the results he has achieved. When he was appointed the team he took over was getting battered on here, comments that they should be replaced by the U19's they were that bad, that the whole lot of them needed to go - so how then do we get into the position where Calderwood is being canned for losing games with them which form part of the 22 game stat - if they were as bad as the vast, vast majority said at the time then are we really surprised he did not win more games last season?

I do normally think you post a lot of sense on here, your comments or shall we say false analysis of what you thought I said in my original post is poor. That is probably why you have numpties agreeing with what you have to say.

Right, I really can't be bothered dragging things out any further, but I will offer a reply, as I feel compelled to.

You stated in your initial post that you were discounting the first ten games of his tenure: -

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Calderwood took over and played a few games with the same players Yogi had, from memory (October, November and January - maybe 10 games), he was not there to turn water into wine - i am discounting those games in terms of any stats used against him

So whilst you didn't actually say that managers can only be judged on their own teams, there is a clear implication there, you must see that. But hey, if you want to see how silly this has become, all I actually said in the first place was "I don't subscribe to the opinion that managers can ONLY be judged on teams that they manage that are predominantly made up of their own signings", so I didn't even say that that was your viewpoint. There is a clear implication though.

After those ten games we then won the next five and drew the following two, securing our SPL status - you then stated: -

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We got ourselves safe and last seasons ends there for me

which sounds an awful lot to me like you are discounting all the defeats after our run, and combined with the first quote, it would logically imply that you are discounting 18 defeats for one reason or another. And whilst you may not have stated that this season hasn't started yet, you are making allowances for the defeats, for a number of reasons.

This pulling quotes apart is really tiresome, and I'm sure it makes really boring reading for anyone who isn't you or me, but you seem to be arguing about syntax and not semantics - your standpoint on Calderwood is not in any way different now to what it was before, despite all of what has been written inbetween. You are stating that what I have extrapolated from your initial quotes is not accurate, which is fine, so we don't need to argue the point any further - you say the inaccuracy is due to bad analysis on my part, I say it's down to you not articulating yourself properly. It really doesn't matter.

As I have said before, your continual backing of Calderwood is admirable, and I will never knock you for that - I just feel that you are making far too many allowances for him, and how we have ended up where we are. Let's just hope that we can turn it around, and that you turn out to be right to make these allowances - that way, we all win.

[cam2644]

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The only protest any fitba club understands and acts on is punters voting with their feet. The drop in ST numbers , an opening fixture crowd of only 12000 odd vs Celtc and subsequent home crowds that afaik havent hit the 10,000 mark are all the protest thats needed.

Any match day protest against CC misses the point that the Board appointed him and previous under performing managers. Any protest against the Board misses the point that ultimately they report to STF. STF is the key. Maybe hes not happy with the cycle of under performing managers , decreasing crowds and abysmal on field fare from his community team. Or maybe in the current financial climate hes content for us to tread water as a bottom 6 SPL club budgeting on us always retaining a hard core 5000 to 6000 Season ticket fanbase. Either way we'll never know as his Board shield him from any direct questioning.

Best assessment I've seen on this thread

[JimBHibees]

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I'd normally agree Matty but we were 2nd to a high proportion of balls at the PBSy. I am now of the mindset that if we struggle to get up for that, how will we manage against anyone else?

Even there IMO our support was very poor dont remember any Hibs songs at the game more an obsession with a dodgy guy playing in Kaunas. Once they scored no support at all in saying that the performance was very poor. At home I have no doubt teams are told to keep it tight and if you nick the first goal the fans will get on their backs. In saying that the team needs to inspire the fans also.

[marinello59]

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I'd normally agree Matty but we were 2nd to a high proportion of balls at the PBSy. I am now of the mindset that if we struggle to get up for that, how will we manage against anyone else?

That's my concern as well. I really hope we see a team fully commited and aware of what each of them have to do. The evidence so far suggests that's unlikely though. Fingers crossed CC has it right this time.

[Phil MaGlass]

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I spoke to Mr Petrie on Sunday, and he knows the feeling of the fans and the current disenchantment.....

FWIW I think the protest is pointless and silly, we have signed a number of new players, who will need time to get acclimatised to surroundings and gel into a team......

I also think we will beat the dons.......

I dont think this type of protest is pointless or silly, the last time anyone at Hibs protested was the Hands Off Hibs if Im not wrong? Thing is, we the fans do not get listened to, re. Ko times/days, 10 team league wtf? ticket prices the poor fair on show for as long as we can remember, I could go on and on and on... it seems that Hibs fans are quite content to sit around waiting years for an end product...oh,... no... wait a moment, no were not,they have stopped coming altogether, maybe if the protest/s had started years ago instead of now the fans voice may have been heard, and we wouldnt be 2-3000 fans down every week.
Outside Scotland it is the norm to protest, why should we be any different, have we become so accustomed to mediocrity that we take it as the norm, give me protesting any day to sitting on ma erse for years hoping things will get better then eventually turning yir back on the club and going to IKEA with the wife.
I personally will not be joining this protest as I think we will be turning the corner within the next 4 weeks, but I wish something like this had been organised years ago.
Dont blame the guy/s for having the initiative to do this, Im sure Im not the only one who wished something like this had happened LONG before now.We are surely smart enough to see where the guy/s is/are coming from, let them have their protest, it may well send a message to the club saying "OK enough is enough" and "you have to stop taking us for granted".
"STAND UP AND BE COUNTED" NO?

[Albion Hibs]

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Right, I really can't be bothered dragging things out any further, but I will offer a reply, as I feel compelled to.

You stated in your initial post that you were discounting the first ten games of his tenure: -



So whilst you didn't actually say that managers can only be judged on their own teams, there is a clear implication there, you must see that. But hey, if you want to see how silly this has become, all I actually said in the first place was "I don't subscribe to the opinion that managers can ONLY be judged on teams that they manage that are predominantly made up of their own signings", so I didn't even say that that was your viewpoint. There is a clear implication though.

After those ten games we then won the next five and drew the following two, securing our SPL status - you then stated: -

which sounds an awful lot to me like you are discounting all the defeats after our run, and combined with the first quote, it would logically imply that you are discounting 18 defeats for one reason or another. And whilst you may not have stated that this season hasn't started yet, you are making allowances for the defeats, for a number of reasons.

This pulling quotes apart is really tiresome, and I'm sure it makes really boring reading for anyone who isn't you or me, but you seem to be arguing about syntax and not semantics - your standpoint on Calderwood is not in any way different now to what it was before, despite all of what has been written inbetween. You are stating that what I have extrapolated from your initial quotes is not accurate, which is fine, so we don't need to argue the point any further - you say the inaccuracy is due to bad analysis on my part, I say it's down to you not articulating yourself properly. It really doesn't matter.

As I have said before, your continual backing of Calderwood is admirable, and I will never knock you for that - I just feel that you are making far too many allowances for him, and how we have ended up where we are. Let's just hope that we can turn it around, and that you turn out to be right to make these allowances - that way, we all win.

"you say the inaccuracy is due to bad analysis on my part" - yes I do, see the bits in bold and underlined, you have in said it yourself above. But I will agree it is boring this analysis of words, your thoughts on what you think I said, was thinking at the time etc are wrong, I am sure you can appreciate you are not reading my mind!

I am not making excuses for him all the time. I have been honest enough on match/player ratings threads when I have said we were not good enough, but I perhaps dont vent as much of it towards him as others, but rather some of the players.

My simple view is that last season just about everyone said "we need an entire new squad", that last years players were "the worst they have ever seen in a hibs jersey", that the "under 19's would be a massive improvement" and our squad was "fit for relegation". So I wont ask you, but my view is that if the team last season was so bad then of the 17 loses, or whatever it was, out of the 22 games, what could we really expect from him? I would say I did not expect much, I hoped he would keep us up, but I did not expect him to turn "the worst ever team in a hibs jersey" into winners by looking at them.

The start of this year has not been good, we should be beating St Mirren at home, as for away to hearts I would hope we pump them, but would not be expecting anything, away to Killie cant remember the last time we won, but equally cant remember as bad a going over as we got on that day. So in my view we are maybe 3 points behind were an optamistic me would have us, and I dont blame Calderwood for those three points.

We desperatly needed a right back, we only managed to get one before the last game, we needed something more in midfield (Osborne) again only 2 games under his belt, we maybe needed more of a pentaly box threat (griffiths 15mins of action). These guys should have had a pre-season with us, but they did not and we are feeling the effects in my view. Was it Calderwoods fault they were not there from day one, probably not.

I am not going to judge the guy saying he is a terrible manager, because he did not win more games last season with the "worst ever hibs team" (hibs.net 2010/2011), and I am going to give him time with the players he has brought in.

[silverhibee]

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Yeap, they do.
Why before the match though when it will affect the players? After the match?..........if that's what people want to do it's up to them.

I doubt the players will know whats happening outside the ground, cannot see it affecting them how they play, infact can they play any worse than what they have of latley.

[marinello59]

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I doubt the players will know whats happening outside the ground, cannot see it affecting them how they play, infact can they play any worse than what they have of latley.

I ******* hope not.

[Jack]

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I ******* hope not.

STOP trying to bypass the swear filter

We all know what ******* means

[Stevie Reid]

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"you say the inaccuracy is due to bad analysis on my part" - yes I do, see the bits in bold and underlined, you have in said it yourself above. But I will agree it is boring this analysis of words, your thoughts on what you think I said, was thinking at the time etc are wrong, I am sure you can appreciate you are not reading my mind!

I am not making excuses for him all the time. I have been honest enough on match/player ratings threads when I have said we were not good enough, but I perhaps dont vent as much of it towards him as others, but rather some of the players.

My simple view is that last season just about everyone said "we need an entire new squad", that last years players were "the worst they have ever seen in a hibs jersey", that the "under 19's would be a massive improvement" and our squad was "fit for relegation". So I wont ask you, but my view is that if the team last season was so bad then of the 17 loses, or whatever it was, out of the 22 games, what could we really expect from him? I would say I did not expect much, I hoped he would keep us up, but I did not expect him to turn "the worst ever team in a hibs jersey" into winners by looking at them.

The start of this year has not been good, we should be beating St Mirren at home, as for away to hearts I would hope we pump them, but would not be expecting anything, away to Killie cant remember the last time we won, but equally cant remember as bad a going over as we got on that day. So in my view we are maybe 3 points behind were an optamistic me would have us, and I dont blame Calderwood for those three points.

We desperatly needed a right back, we only managed to get one before the last game, we needed something more in midfield (Osborne) again only 2 games under his belt, we maybe needed more of a pentaly box threat (griffiths 15mins of action). These guys should have had a pre-season with us, but they did not and we are feeling the effects in my view. Was it Calderwoods fault they were not there from day one, probably not.

I am not going to judge the guy saying he is a terrible manager, because he did not win more games last season with the "worst ever hibs team" (hibs.net 2010/2011), and I am going to give him time with the players he has brought in.

Of course, I did allude to that in my last post, but in case it wasn't clear enough, I am neither daft/arrogant enough to continue to argue when you have confirmed what you meant in your initial post. I was just highlighting why I thought it was more than reasonable for me to draw the conclusions that I did, but you have confirmed that I was off the mark and I accept that.

No point discussing the rest of the post any further, we clearly have differing views on CC. FWIW, I don't believe that he is a terrible manager, despite the fact that I believe he is doing a terrible job - sometimes people don't fit in certain places, there have been numerous examples over the years of a manager with a good pedigree failing somewhere, then going on to be a success elsewhere. Brendan Rogers is a good recent example, taking Reading to the brink of relegation from the Championship and being sacked, then taking Swansea into the Premiership in his first season there. I just don't think Hibs and CC are a good fit, though I really hope I'm proved wrong.

Here's hoping for a win on Sunday.

[HibsMax]

I wonder how many of the protesters will go into watch the game after protesting, and how many of them will voice their concerns and then go home. If the protesters plan on entering the game after then I hope there are 15,000 of them.

[Albion Hibs]

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Of course, I did allude to that in my last post, but in case it wasn't clear enough, I am neither daft/arrogant enough to continue to argue when you have confirmed what you meant in your initial post. I was just highlighting why I thought it was more than reasonable for me to draw the conclusions that I did, but you have confirmed that I was off the mark and I accept that.

No point discussing the rest of the post any further, we clearly have differing views on CC. FWIW, I don't believe that he is a terrible manager, despite the fact that I believe he is doing a terrible job - sometimes people don't fit in certain places, there have been numerous examples over the years of a manager with a good pedigree failing somewhere, then going on to be a success elsewhere. Brendan Rogers is a good recent example, taking Reading to the brink of relegation from the Championship and being sacked, then taking Swansea into the Premiership in his first season there. I just don't think Hibs and CC are a good fit, though I really hope I'm proved wrong.

Here's hoping for a win on Sunday.

Well finally we have something that we can agree on 110%.

Fingers crossed we pump the sheep and get this season off and running. Who knows maybe some of the 10 objectors will come into the stadium after and support the team and manager rather than dashing off home to watch Wigan V's Bolton or some other nonsence on Sky Sports.

[nortonhibby]

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Our average attendance dropped by about 1500-1600 in the first division and raised by again by a similar amount after we got promoted.

But the difference was the away teams brought very few fans and when we were winning every week the actual amount of Home supporters increased condiderably.

[marinello59]

It's just been on Radio Scotland that Fife Hyland has offered to meet the organisers of the protest.

[LancashireHibby]

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It's just been on Radio Scotland that Fife Hyland has offered to meet the organisers of the protest.

BBC link

[smurf]

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our hard core 5000 will never leave us even if the un thinkable happened and we got relegated last time we went down our crowds increased to so us winning every week was a joy.

This myth does my head in....

No our crowds didn't increase!

[MrSmith]

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BBC link

That interview is simply p@sh!

We will listen to any disgruntled fan however we hope the real fans will drown them out! What message does that send? Fyfe - go **** off! You need to listen to everybody's dog and their opinions!

Sick of this bull****!

I love Hibs but am now defining the line between the club 'Hibernian' and the custodians because the custodians don't give a *** about th supporters!

Albion Hibs - don't bother!

[nortonhibby]

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This myth does my head in....

No our crowds didn't increase!

i was there home fans increased away fans went down when we win every week the sun shines, tbo some of the away games that year were a hoot.

[RIP]

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I love Hibs but am now defining the line between the club 'Hibernian' and the custodians because the custodians don't give a *** about th supporters!

Ever talked to Fife or Scott since they got their new jobs? Unlike Petrie's reign they dinnae hide. In the stands, Behind the Goals, Hibs TV, YouTube. They care every bit as much as us Smith. If you dinnae believe go and talk to their faces.

Or would you prefer anonomously abusing them behind their backs on messageboards?