Does Our Club Have Any Leadership Whatsoever At The Moment?

[JimBHibees]

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And if so can any examples of it be given?

What exactly did our 'leadership' think of our performance as a football club in season 2010/2011.

Where do they think we need to improve if they think that we do?

What was the last piece of communication from our 'leadership' to us the fans?

Just asking as most organisations successful in life have a bit of leadership. And we appear to have none whatsoever.

And appear to be just drifting....

At least your consistent if not a little repetitive.

[sunshine1875]

Has anyone got a link to the statement that was issued a couple of years ago? It seemed to follow a period when a lot of fans on here were questioning our leadership and direction, IIRC.

It would be good to read it again!

[JimBHibees]

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"...last season was hugely disappointing. Next year we know we must do much better". Rod Petrie.

"Finishing tenth is unacceptable for a club of our standing. We all know that.". Scott Lindsay.

Such comments if we got them would give an interesting insight.

But they don't give such comments. And won't.

Why would we want them to state the bleedingly obvious.

[Kaiser1962]

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Leadership isn't just about communication so, while their communication is generally poor, I wouldn't use that as a barometer.

Leadership is about appointing the right people to key positions and giving them the tools, working environment and authority to be successful in that role. In that respect, Hibs have utterly failed.

Off the field, they're very good at building stuff though.

But they have the tools and the working environment. Talented people in this industry get very big wages that we do have the income to match. Once they prove they are talented they are offered huge money (not just personally) and the quality of player they are working with, or able to attract, increases ten fold. At Hibs they are very unlikely to get anywhere near the Old Firm so their opportunities are limited.

I dont think CC has proved himself to be particularly talented yet, but hoped he would this season, and he seems to be sought after already. It beggars belief if we're not even going to get a year out of a manager now.

I also notice that Der Hun have failed on all their main signing targets as well (to date at least) so i think that tells us more about the market we are in.

British League anyone?

[Beefster]

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But they have the tools and the working environment. Talented people in this industry get very big wages that we do have the income to match. Once they prove they are talented they are offered huge money (not just personally) and the quality of player they are working with, or able to attract, increases ten fold. At Hibs they are very unlikely to get anywhere near the Old Firm so their opportunities are limited.

I dont think CC has proved himself to be particularly talented yet, but hoped he would this season, and he seems to be sought after already. It beggars belief if we're not even going to get a year out of a manager now.

I also notice that Der Hun have failed on all their main signing targets as well (to date at least) so i think that tells us more about the market we are in.

British League anyone?

I wasn't specifically referring to our budget. I think the Board do as well as they can on the budget front given the current income - increasing the income is another topic.

It was more about how things are run and who is in charge of what at ER. I'd argue that enlightened, successful businesses recruit a manager (sometimes passing it to experts to do), give him complete control of running his division (with a budget but he can use that budget how he sees fit) and only get directly involved when that manager requests something or isn't meeting performance targets.

[Kaiser1962]

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I wasn't specifically referring to our budget. I think the Board do as well as they can on the budget front given the current income - increasing the income is another topic.

It was more about how things are run and who is in charge of what at ER. I'd argue that enlightened, successful businesses recruit a manager (sometimes passing it to experts to do), give him complete control of running his division (with a budget but he can use that budget how he sees fit) and only get directly involved when that manager requests something or isn't meeting performance targets.

Thats fair enough but i would counter that there appears to no concrete evidence that the club does not allow the manager to spend his budget as he sees fit other than a couple of ambiguous one liners attributed to a manager who was sacked/left due to poor performance in his area of expertise. While Yogi said he didnt have "full control" he never at any time said he was told what to do football wise.

I will concede, however, that we should perhaps look at the recruitment process perhaps using ex players at the interview stage. That said you could argue that CC is a "successful appointment" because he's being poached.

This won't alter the unpalatable reality that if the appointed (annointed?) candidate is any good he will be off to pastures new in a season and a half, or bulleted if he's not and it starts again.

[smurf]

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Why would we want them to state the bleedingly obvious.

Aren't most 'team talks' just stating the "bleedingly obvious"?

[Albion Hibs]

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[/B]

Is this on or off the park? Because the oft-quoted "competing at the top end of the league, latter stages of the cups, European qualification"...etc., has patently NOT been achieved even it that's what they "wanted to achieve" (to paraphrase you).

Or have I missed the cup semis/final appearances and European nights?

I would think both, lets be honest it is not that long since we won a trophy, qualified for europe, built a new stadium - how many other clubs in the SPL or any other league have done that within the same time period?

In response to the quote you have used, the year before last we had a good season overall which saw us finish 4th and spend much of the season higher than that, we won the CIS cup, and qualified for europe last year. Alas they could say they have achieved these things in part, with the acknowledgement that consistancy is the one thing lacking. Mission Statements and the like will usually have a time period for achievement what was this one?

Fact of the matter is we can all moan about something, but I go back to the top paragraph what other clubs have been led by their boards and managers to achieving all of that over the past 5 or so years?

[Ray_]

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Fact of the matter is we can all moan about something, but I go back to the top paragraph what other clubs have been led by their boards and managers to achieving all of that over the past 5 or so years?

IMHO that was the easy part, we had the assets to sell [land & players], which enabled us to do that. The difficult part will be the next five years as the club need to reverse the current trend, which is seeing fans deserting the club in droves and in turn, causing a large financial deficit.

[Beefster]

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I would think both, lets be honest it is not that long since we won a trophy, qualified for europe, built a new stadium - how many other clubs in the SPL or any other league have done that within the same time period?

In response to the quote you have used, the year before last we had a good season overall which saw us finish 4th and spend much of the season higher than that, we won the CIS cup, and qualified for europe last year. Alas they could say they have achieved these things in part, with the acknowledgement that consistancy is the one thing lacking. Mission Statements and the like will usually have a time period for achievement what was this one?

Fact of the matter is we can all moan about something, but I go back to the top paragraph what other clubs have been led by their boards and managers to achieving all of that over the past 5 or so years?

In the last 5 years....

Motherwell have qualified for Europe and reached a cup final.

Hearts have won the SC and qualified for Europe.

Dundee Utd have won the SC and qualified for Europe.

Aberdeen have qualified for Europe.

[Cropley10]

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In the last 5 years....

Motherwell have qualified for Europe and reached a cup final.

Hearts have won the SC and qualified for Europe.

Dundee Utd have won the SC and qualified for Europe.

Aberdeen have qualified for Europe.

And we've sold the family silver off, had 5 managers, who knows how-many players come and go and just finished 10th!!

You can use statistics anyway you like - but there's no denying we're on a downward trajectory...

[Speedway]

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In the last 5 years....

Motherwell have qualified for Europe and reached a cup final.

Hearts have won the SC and qualified for Europe.

Dundee Utd have won the SC and qualified for Europe.

Aberdeen have qualified for Europe.

Hibs have won the LC and qualified for Europe

[Beefster]

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Hibs have won the LC and qualified for Europe

They have. The poster I was responding to asked if any other clubs had achieved the same as us in the last five years.

[Speedway]

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They have. The poster I was responding to asked if any other clubs had achieved the same as us in the last five years.

Apologies Beef, I read the highlighted part incorrectly.

[Beefster]

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Apologies Beef, I read the highlighted part incorrectly.

No worries. I do it regularly myself!

[Jim44]

Did Colin Deadwood not say that a 1% improvement on last season would be an improvement?

[Albion Hibs]

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In the last 5 years....

Motherwell have qualified for Europe and reached a cup final.

Hearts have won the SC and qualified for Europe.

Dundee Utd have won the SC and qualified for Europe.

Aberdeen have qualified for Europe.

Stadiums, training ground, financial position?

Everyone can adopt the spoilt child attitude of "I want everything" but realism needs to kick in at some point.

I am sure everyone on here has ripped a Jambo about the rented training ground, and the rank little stadium, in doing that you have to take account of the successes we have but need to accept the fact it cant all come at once, and the only reason you can do that to any of the above teams is the leadership of our club.

You could chose to be in awe of the above things you have mentioned, or chose what we have. Other than hertz winning a cup it is really no different to what we have done less the huge significance of the infrastructure expenditure Hibs have made at Easter Road and East Mains.

[Beefster]

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Stadiums, training ground, financial position?

All very good but all of the improvements to these three things in the last five years has been almost entirely because we were lucky enough to have the 'golden generation' come through at once and were able to sell most of them to suitors.

I'm not sure that they are any great endorsement of the master plan of the Board. No Brown, O'Connor, Thomson, Murphy, Fletcher and co - no capital investment without substantially increasing the debt.

[Ray_]

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Stadiums, training ground, financial position?

Everyone can adopt the spoilt child attitude of "I want everything" but realism needs to kick in at some point.

I am sure everyone on here has ripped a Jambo about the rented training ground, and the rank little stadium, in doing that you have to take account of the successes we have but need to accept the fact it cant all come at once, and the only reason you can do that to any of the above teams is the leadership of our club.

You could chose to be in awe of the above things you have mentioned, or chose what we have. Other than hertz winning a cup it is really no different to what we have done less the huge significance of the infrastructure expenditure Hibs have made at Easter Road and East Mains.

We did not do anything exceptional to achieve it, we sold off a once in several generations, collective bunch of riches & the land, what is sooo clever about that? I will be impressed when we start to get close to filling the said stadium on a regular basis though!

[Kaiser1962]

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We did not do anything exceptional to achieve it, we sold off a once in several generations, collective bunch of riches & the land, what is sooo clever about that? I will be impressed when we start to get close to filling the said stadium on a regular basis though!

We had them to sell?

The players who left didnt want to stay and we were stitched up over the land deal.

Of the clubs mentioned in a previous post Motherwell have been in administration, Hearts are a basket case and the Dons and Utd are beholding to and functioning on the goodwill and financial support of their owners.

If somebody wants to step in throw many millions of pounds at the club, money that wont be recovered, then crack on.

[Albion Hibs]

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We did not do anything exceptional to achieve it, we sold off a once in several generations, collective bunch of riches & the land, what is sooo clever about that? I will be impressed when we start to get close to filling the said stadium on a regular basis though!

But in the meantime stand back and thow stones whilst sitting in the stadium and no doubt having a dig at a few jambos for their predicament.

Out of interest how much do you feel this once in a generation group of players would have made of us if they had stayed the guts of 10m - we would have to win just about everything going.

Not realistic, more nostalgic in my view.

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We had them to sell?

The players who left didnt want to stay and we were stitched up over the land deal.

Of the clubs mentioned in a previous post Motherwell have been in administration, Hearts are a basket case and the Dons and Utd are beholding to and functioning on the goodwill and financial support of their owners.

If somebody wants to step in throw many millions of pounds at the club, money that wont be recovered, then crack on.

Bang on. We did have to sell them or we would have ended up with nothing when they walked away for free. There on the pitch achievements in my view are unlikely to have amounted to what we recieved back from them.

Each of the players gave several seasons, so we got entertainment value from that, in addition we benefited significantly and were able to invest in the club which fans for generations will benefit from.

[Stevie Reid]

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We did not do anything exceptional to achieve it, we sold off a once in several generations, collective bunch of riches & the land, what is sooo clever about that? I will be impressed when we start to get close to filling the said stadium on a regular basis though!

If we didn't do anything exceptional to achieve our current sound financial footing and completed infrastructure, how come every other SPL club isn't in the same position as us financially and with a training centre?

The Golden Generation was exceptional, it is rare for so many young players to come through at once and the club, the youth system, the coaching staff and the scouting network all deserve credit for that. They players contributed to some excellent football, high league finishes and a cup win and semi final appearances, before almost wiping out £17M worth of debt when they were sold - is that not exceptional?

The amount of times that our achievements get talked down and dismissed on this board is unbelievable.

[IWasThere2016]

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The players who left didnt want to stay and we were stitched up over the land deal

You've lost me K'62

[Kaiser1962]

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You've lost me K'62

The car park, Farmer and housing. City council and court case and so on.

[Ray_]

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But in the meantime stand back and thow stones whilst sitting in the stadium and no doubt having a dig at a few jambos for their predicament.

Out of interest how much do you feel this once in a generation group of players would have made of us if they had stayed the guts of 10m - we would have to win just about everything going.

Not realistic, more nostalgic in my view.



Bang on. We did have to sell them or we would have ended up with nothing when they walked away for free. There on the pitch achievements in my view are unlikely to have amounted to what we recieved back from them.

Each of the players gave several seasons, so we got entertainment value from that, in addition we benefited significantly and were able to invest in the club which fans for generations will benefit from.

I haven't a clue what you are going on about!!

Selling saleable assets is not an exceptional achievement, what will be exceptional is if we start producing a product that will bi-weekly pack out our stadium.

[Kaiser1962]

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I haven't a clue what you are going on about!!

Selling saleable assets is not an exceptional achievement, what will be exceptional is if we start producing a product that will bi-weekly pack out our stadium.

When did that last happen?

[RIP]

I think our board are playing the long game and going about things in the right way

[Ray_]

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If we didn't do anything exceptional to achieve our current sound financial footing and completed infrastructure, how come every other SPL club isn't in the same position as us financially and with a training centre?

The Golden Generation was exceptional, it is rare for so many young players to come through at once and the club, the youth system, the coaching staff and the scouting network all deserve credit for that. They players contributed to some excellent football, high league finishes and a cup win and semi final appearances, before almost wiping out £17M worth of debt when they were sold - is that not exceptional?

The amount of times that our achievements get talked down and dismissed on this board is unbelievable.

The Golden Generation was exceptional, agreed, and the management and back-room rightly deserve credit for the emergence of that team.

What made that team exceptional was the amount of talent coming through together. For the club to be exceptional, it would be to produce that sort of talent on a regular basis & not having to witness the dross that driven so many of the support away from ER.

[Ray_]

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When did that last happen?

So why waste money & expand, if that wasn't the aim?

[Andy74]

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We did not do anything exceptional to achieve it, we sold off a once in several generations, collective bunch of riches & the land, what is sooo clever about that? I will be impressed when we start to get close to filling the said stadium on a regular basis though!

We did, we made several difficult decisions very early that no-one here understood why and were dead against.

These led to being in a position where we awere ahead of the game and ultimatley we were able to get the best money for our players because we were in a position to demand it and not jump at the first offer because we needed to.

The arrangements that were put in place for the land around the stadium and the repurchase of the stadium were done on extremely beneficial terms and the board and owner need to be given credit for doing that and not lining any pockets.

The footballing side is one thing and despite a lot of backing something isn't working, but it's a bit much to try and belittle the achievements that have been made off the park.