Mls/usl/nasl

[AZhibee]

I really wish that the football pyramid would take a proper system with promotion and relegation. Seems like NASL is being killed off to favor USL, but I wonder if a pyramid system is in their plans with USL as a tier 2 as it is more than half a development league?

Any thoughts on MLS expansion favorites? Really hoping for a Phoenix Rising FC team in the MLS.

[Haymaker]

I believe that they recently turned down huge TV investment - billions of $ IIRC - as the condition would be that promotion and relegation had to happen.

So we won't be seeing that anytime soon!

[AZhibee]

Think the TV bid was not serious, but agreed doesn't look they want any part of it.

[GreenLake]

I really wish that the football pyramid would take a proper system with promotion and relegation. Seems like NASL is being killed off to favor USL, but I wonder if a pyramid system is in their plans with USL as a tier 2 as it is more than half a development league?

Any thoughts on MLS expansion favorites? Really hoping for a Phoenix Rising FC team in the MLS.

I think if it did the Galaxy would drop down to USL this year as they are not only losing but getting pasted each game. One of the new MLS teams, Atlanta United, hammered us 4.0 last week and they look very good in their first season. I think it is healthy that big franchises in MLS have bad seasons to show that there is competition in the league. LA fans are notoriously fair weather but I hardly miss a home game even when it gets brutal to watch!

Minnesota United is the other new franchise this season but the next team to join will be LAFC in 2018. LA will then have what might be called the Hollywood Derby.

I think Drogba might own part of the Pheonix team so that might help their cause but a Miami franchise owned by Beckham will probably join first.

[KWJ]

Standard with North American sports though isn't it. With things like the draft and such teams can even deliberately bomb in order to finish last and get the top pick. Not sure if that is a thing in MLS but certainly in other sports.

[AZhibee]

I think if it did the Galaxy would drop down to USL this year as they are not only losing but getting pasted each game. One of the new MLS teams, Atlanta United, hammered us 4.0 last week and they look very good in their first season. I think it is healthy that big franchises in MLS have bad seasons to show that there is competition in the league. LA fans are notoriously fair weather but I hardly miss a home game even when it gets brutal to watch!

Minnesota United is the other new franchise this season but the next team to join will be LAFC in 2018. LA will then have what might be called the Hollywood Derby.

I think Drogba might own part of the Pheonix team so that might help their cause but a Miami franchise owned by Beckham will probably join first.

Maybe the Inglewood Derby.
Drogba is a part owner. Miami is in, Sac, Cincy, San Antonio, Nashville, Phx strong contenders for next 4. Phx has the stadium plan, city size, and no other team nearby...but a crowded competition. For fun I'd say give 8-12+ NASL or USL teams MLS II status and play for a promotion spot.

[Haymaker]

For fun I'd say give 8-12+ NASL or USL teams MLS II status and play for a promotion spot.

That is what they should do definitely.

They should also take away the draft and allow teams to develop their own. USA football won't improve until the players are developed in a similar fashion to the rest of the world.

[GreenLake]

Maybe the Inglewood Derby.
Drogba is a part owner. Miami is in, Sac, Cincy, San Antonio, Nashville, Phx strong contenders for next 4. Phx has the stadium plan, city size, and no other team nearby...but a crowded competition. For fun I'd say give 8-12+ NASL or USL teams MLS II status and play for a promotion spot.

American sports don't have relegation but they have the draft and salary caps to enforce competition.

Pheonix would be a nice away trip.

Inglewood Derby will be Rams vs Chargers.

[Haymaker]

American sports don't have relegation but they have the draft and salary caps to enforce competition.

Pheonix would be a nice away trip.

Inglewood Derby will be Rams vs Chargers.

In sports with no competition elsewhere. Unfortunately for American soccer, there is competition. And so the draft, caps etc hinder the teams ability to get and keep any significant talent.

[AZhibee]

In sports with no competition elsewhere. Unfortunately for American soccer, there is competition. And so the draft, caps etc hinder the teams ability to get and keep any significant talent.

Indeed, salary cap doesn't work in football/soccer.

I figure the only MLS will increase interest is by more matkets captured, which might need a 2+ tier system.

[GreenLake]

In sports with no competition elsewhere. Unfortunately for American soccer, there is competition. And so the draft, caps etc hinder the teams ability to get and keep any significant talent.

There is competition within MLS which makes it more interesting for MLS fans. Eleven different teams have become MLS Champions since 1996 compared to two teams in Scotland winning the league since 1985. There are plenty of leagues outside of the US unable to get and keep any significant talent. MLS fans like to watch EPL, La Liga, Bundesliga and Serie A over here on TV and nobody thinks MLS is on the same level but nothing on TV gets close to watching a game in a stadium. That goes for most sports.

[Haymaker]

There is competition within MLS which makes it more interesting for MLS fans. Eleven different teams have become MLS Champions since 1996 compared to two teams in Scotland winning the league since 1985. There are plenty of leagues outside of the US unable to get and keep any significant talent. MLS fans like to watch EPL, La Liga, Bundesliga and Serie A over here on TV and nobody thinks MLS is on the same level but nothing on TV gets close to watching a game in a stadium. That goes for most sports.

There's plenty of competition inside it but it can't compete outside for talent which means it can never increase it's level above what it currently is. As a professional coach I can only say that the college system, draft, salary caps and roster restrictions are hampering the development of US talent.

Christian Pulisic had the right idea leaving to play at a better level outside his comfort zone and earn some real money.

[AZhibee]

There is competition within MLS which makes it more interesting for MLS fans. Eleven different teams have become MLS Champions since 1996 compared to two teams in Scotland winning the league since 1985. There are plenty of leagues outside of the US unable to get and keep any significant talent. MLS fans like to watch EPL, La Liga, Bundesliga and Serie A over here on TV and nobody thinks MLS is on the same level but nothing on TV gets close to watching a game in a stadium. That goes for most sports.

Indeed, MLS seems to know their level, they will not compete like the NFL, but can find success among football fans who view the MLS as their local football affiliation, but also watch EPL, La Liga or whatever else.

Since there is no MLS team here, I barely follow it. It is as easier to watch to EPL on TV...or in my case watch Hibs TV:flag:.

At Phx Rising FC games I see numerous EPL shirts, several Bundesliga's, lots of Real and Barca, the occassional Italian or French, some Mexico, an assortment of others including 1 Scottish one (Me-Hibs), and maybe 1 or 2 MLS tops and that is is it. Without a MLS club in town it is hard to generate enthusiasm, like you say TV doesn't replace a game in the stadium.

[AZhibee]

There's plenty of competition inside it but it can't compete outside for talent which means it can never increase it's level above what it currently is. As a professional coach I can only say that the college system, draft, salary caps and roster restrictions are hampering the development of US talent.

Christian Pulisic had the right idea leaving to play at a better level outside his comfort zone and earn some real money.

True that, seems that the MLS won't increase it level much, but that is fine provided they don't aspire too being in a level beyond their means (old NASL).

[Haymaker]

True that, seems that the MLS won't increase it level much, but that is fine provided they don't aspire too being in a level beyond their means (old NASL).

Which is fine and in some ways very sensible however USA men's football will never improve without changes to the format.

[GreenLake]

There's plenty of competition inside it but it can't compete outside for talent which means it can never increase it's level above what it currently is. As a professional coach I can only say that the college system, draft, salary caps and roster restrictions are hampering the development of US talent.

Christian Pulisic had the right idea leaving to play at a better level outside his comfort zone and earn some real money.

I can't see MLS ever competing with European Leagues but they do a good job internally in my view.

The US team is having problems for sure and I can't see a quick fix. Some of my mates here are gutted over recent performances. Maybe you can make some suggestions to Pam Perkins, an English lady who is the Manager of Special Projects at US Soccer Federation. She is really cool and might be interesting to know on a professional level. If you can't find her contact info at ussoccer.com I can pm you her email.

[Haymaker]

I can't see MLS ever competing with European Leagues but they do a good job internally in my view.

The US team is having problems for sure and I can't see a quick fix. Some of my mates here are gutted over recent performances. Maybe you can make some suggestions to Pam Perkins, an English lady who is the Manager of Special Projects at US Soccer Federation. She is really cool and might be interesting to know on a professional level. If you can't find her contact info at ussoccer.com I can pm you her email.

Yes they do a good job internally and you're right - they'll never compete seriously with the European leagues. For me though the league could do a better job by encouraging better talent and keeping younger talent here if the wage structures weren't that ridgid.

On developing US talent I don't think USSF can change all that much - the game is too expensive, the college system is flawed and the club's can't sign players to youth contracts so will lose any exceptional talent to Europe for free so there's little incentive for clubs to develop their own.

And dont get me started on NYCFC playing in that ****hole in the Bronx...

[AZhibee]

Yes they do a good job internally and you're right - they'll never compete seriously with the European leagues. For me though the league could do a better job by encouraging better talent and keeping younger talent here if the wage structures weren't that ridgid.

On developing US talent I don't think USSF can change all that much - the game is too expensive, the college system is flawed and the club's can't sign players to youth contracts so will lose any exceptional talent to Europe for free so there's little incentive for clubs to develop their own.

And dont get me started on NYCFC playing in that ****hole in the Bronx...


Interesting! I don't foresee youth contracts in the US, but are the seeds of an academy present in the MLS development squads(Sounders 2, Timbers 2...) ? I have seen a couple of them play this year.

[GreenLake]

Yes they do a good job internally and you're right - they'll never compete seriously with the European leagues. For me though the league could do a better job by encouraging better talent and keeping younger talent here if the wage structures weren't that ridgid.

On developing US talent I don't think USSF can change all that much - the game is too expensive, the college system is flawed and the club's can't sign players to youth contracts so will lose any exceptional talent to Europe for free so there's little incentive for clubs to develop their own.

And dont get me started on NYCFC playing in that ****hole in the Bronx...

I don't watch college soccer but maybe I should.

[Haymaker]

I don't watch college soccer but maybe I should.

It's alright - the problem is that the players are all roughly the same age and level with no chance of playing higher until 21 at least because why would they give up a college degree -probably a scholarship?

But the mls clubs can't sign players to youth contracts because then they're ineligible to play at college if they fail to make the grade - why would a player throw that chance away?

However for the development of US talent that system doesn't work!

[AZhibee]

I don't watch college soccer but maybe I should.

I will probably see some JUCO soccer this weekend, or an NAIA Women's game.

[AZhibee]

It's alright - the problem is that the players are all roughly the same age and level with no chance of playing higher until 21 at least because why would they give up a college degree -probably a scholarship?

But the mls clubs can't sign players to youth contracts because then they're ineligible to play at college if they fail to make the grade - why would a player throw that chance away?

However for the development of US talent that system doesn't work!

Perhaps recent events in college basketball will spur some change in several sports-where common sense finally comes in. Alma mater is in a heap of trouble.

[Haymaker]

Perhaps recent events in college basketball will spur some change in several sports-where common sense finally comes in. Alma mater is in a heap of trouble.

Is that the adidas thing?

[AZhibee]

Is that the adidas thing?

Yes, it is a bad day when the FBI arrests your assistant coach.

[Haymaker]

Yes, it is a bad day when the FBI arrests your assistant coach.

Just a tad!

[NYHibby]

How do you envision promotion and relegation working when the league owns all of the teams? The teams don't exist at all in a legal sense. You could do a MLS II, but there is no way a pyramid could work in practice.

You are also incorrectly assuming that USL teams want to be promoted to the MLS.


It's alright - the problem is that the players are all roughly the same age and level with no chance of playing higher until 21 at least because why would they give up a college degree -probably a scholarship?

But the mls clubs can't sign players to youth contracts because then they're ineligible to play at college if they fail to make the grade - why would a player throw that chance away?


I don't want to pull a "you don't know what you're talking about and dash" but surely if you're a "professional coach" in the US you realise the problems with your two paragraphs.

[GreenLake]

They have given out large cards with yellow on one side and red on the other. Perhaps to assist the referee when Jones makes a tackle.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170927/401ff62e15c3c87994e8dadc3a19b38c.jpg

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

[Haymaker]

I don't want to pull a "you don't know what you're talking about and dash" but surely if you're a "professional coach" in the US you realise the problems with your two paragraphs.

I do recognise the problems in my paragraphs - it's what makes it so frustrating.

EDIT: To clarify my position as it has kind of gotten lost: I currently do not think the system to develop US talent is any good. In part due to the MLS structure and set up and partly the college scholarship issue.

I'd like to see the MLS/US soccer have a pyramid system but the way it's set up obviously stops that anyway.

[AZhibee]

Pyramid works when MLS expands enough to start a second division, the demand seems to be there. USL can be a blended development league with small independent clubs.

[AZhibee]

Read that 2 expansion bids will be announced December 19-20. Nashille seems to be producing fake news that they have been selected, keeping themselves in spotlight, while Sacramento started their stadium construction. Cincy continues to promote themself as well. Seem crazy competitive... Still think Phoenix has the population and lack of a team nearby, and supposed stadium plan, that keep them in competition.

[AZhibee]

http://www.sportingnews.com/soccer/news/world-cup-qualifying-mls-helping-concacafs-budding-powers-compete-with-usa-and-mexico/18dibwf67277ezkc7pfqbtqcr

Sporting News reporting that MLS has helped CONCACAF countries compete and improve. Costa Rica seems like a legit power.

[AZhibee]

The article was even more poignant after US elimination tonight, Sounder player scoring one of the two goals keeping us out. Disgraceful result for US.

[Haymaker]

The article was even more poignant after US elimination tonight, Sounder player scoring one of the two goals keeping us out. Disgraceful result for US.

:agree:

Although I'd disagree with the last paragraph. It isn't helping US talent.

[AZhibee]

[QUOTE=Haymaker;5189490]:agree:

Although I'd disagree with the last paragraph. It isn't helping US talent.[/QUOTE

I guess you're right as displayed tonight. Watched the game with my son to get him hyped for the World Cup...fortunately like many US fans he is far more interested in Real Madrid.

[AZhibee]

Columbus to Austin? If true or of it pans out could or will negatively impact San Antonio's MLS bid.

[Haymaker]

Columbus to Austin? If true or of it pans out could or will negatively impact San Antonio's MLS bid.

I always thought that Columbus was a strange place to have a team. Would be a shame if they moved though, imagine spending the last 10/15 seasons watching them for the team to just go somewhere else.

[AZhibee]

I always thought that Columbus was a strange place to have a team. Would be a shame if they moved though, imagine spending the last 10/15 seasons watching them for the team to just go somewhere else.

Yeah, Columbus seemed like a novelty - Green Bay. Unfortunately demand seems so high for a franchise that Crew owner can leverage (or black mail) public financing. I presume that the 12 cities looking for expansion teams are precluded from negotiations with exisiting franchises otherwise there would be a bidding war for Crew.

Phoenix has stared their media campaign to push for a franchise;

http://www.espnfc.com/major-league-soccer/story/3235204/phoenix-rising-high-in-push-for-mls-place

I figure Phx will get a franchise and Hibs will visit during the 2022 World Cup winter break:flag:

[GreenLake]

Out of 12 cities bidding (https://www.mlssoccer.com/topic/expansion/2017/expansion-cities-bids) for four new MLS franchises Nashville has been chosen (https://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2017/12/20/nashville-awarded-mls-expansion-club) as the first. Maybe the success of Atlanta in their first MLS season helped the choice for another Southeast team.

[AZhibee]

Out of 12 cities bidding (https://www.mlssoccer.com/topic/expansion/2017/expansion-cities-bids) for four new MLS franchises Nashville has been chosen (https://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2017/12/20/nashville-awarded-mls-expansion-club) as the first. Maybe the success of Atlanta in their first MLS season helped the choice for another Southeast team.

Sacramento gets snubbed. I think the MLS wants to see who else can get their act together before risking Sacramento. Possibly St Louis or San Diego.

Hopefully this is good news for Phoenix, they need western teams, and are waiting to see who else emerges before making any commitments. With Austin maybe canceling out San Antonio and Sac being snubbed, opening there for Phoenix Rising FC.

[Pretty Boy]

I see Miami has officially been named as a new franchise today.

[Haymaker]

Sadly they won't be named The Miami Vice

[GreenLake]

I see Miami has officially been named as a new franchise today.

I talked to an Uber driver a few days ago in Miami. He said Beckham had bought a load of land for building the new stadium.

[Haymaker]

I talked to an Uber driver a few days ago in Miami. He said Beckham had bought a load of land for building the new stadium.

Doubt Beckham did - he's too savvy for that, won't be his money!

[AZhibee]

Sadly they won't be named The Miami Vice

:top marks:top marks:top marks

Now thats effin hilarious

Imagine the theme song being played as they drove onto the pitch in DeLoreans, exiting with sunglasses on.

[AZhibee]

I see Miami has officially been named as a new franchise today.

Still 3 more to go, Miami deal done years ago. Still looks like Cincy will be next and Sacramento will be shafted. Detroit won't build a football specific stadium so who knows for the final two....Phoenix still a possibilty!!

[Haymaker]

:top marks:top marks:top marks

Now thats effin hilarious

Imagine the theme song being played as they drove onto the pitch in DeLoreans, exiting with sunglasses on.

Exactly. Totally missed opportunity

[GreenLake]

Doubt Beckham did - he's too savvy for that, won't be his money!

The land around stadiums usually becomes more valuable as surrounding amenities compete for rents. He might have the city build the stadium but I bet he has bought surrounding tracts to develop into hotels, condos and retail.

[AZhibee]

The land around stadiums usually becomes more valuable as surrounding amenities compete for rents. He might have the city build the stadium but I bet he has bought surrounding tracts to develop into hotels, condos and retail.

Think that was the deal in Nashville, developers got the land around the stadium as part of the deal, with further development plans in place.

[GreenLake]

Think that was the deal in Nashville, developers got the land around the stadium as part of the deal, with further development plans in place.

Might be worth buying a few lots around the proposed site in Phoenix.

[AZhibee]

Might be worth buying a few lots around the proposed site in Phoenix.

Lol, stadium on tribal land and I’m as white as Simon Murray.

[GreenLake]

Lol, stadium on tribal land and I’m as white as Simon Murray.

Peace pipe.

[GreenLake]

http://www.latimes.com/sports/soccer/la-sp-galaxy-lafc-20180328-story.html

Looks like the first derby game today might be fun. I have season tickets for both LAFC and LA Galaxy so will wear a Hibs jersey to the game.

[AZhibee]

http://www.latimes.com/sports/soccer/la-sp-galaxy-lafc-20180328-story.html

Looks like the first derby game today might be fun. I have season tickets for both LAFC and LA Galaxy so will wear a Hibs jersey to the game.

Will look for you on TV!
LAFC tearin' em up!

[AZhibee]

Holy Cow, Ibramazing! What a goal!

[AZhibee]

Even more amazing, unreal!

[AZhibee]

http://www.latimes.com/sports/soccer/la-sp-galaxy-lafc-20180328-story.html

Looks like the first derby game today might be fun. I have season tickets for both LAFC and LA Galaxy so will wear a Hibs jersey to the game.

Amazing game you got to see.
(Ibrahim was offside on second I think, but who cares)
Stadium energy looked great on TV.

[Haymaker]

The guy certainly backs up his mouth!

[GreenLake]

Amazing game you got to see.
(Ibrahim was offside on second I think, but who cares)
Stadium energy looked great on TV.

I thought he was offside in the replay too.

Unreal contest and a great display by LAFC for a lot of it.

Ibrahimovic's first goal was amazing to watch and I had to celebrate it.

Great derby and good signs for football in LA. Although a couple of thugs tried to start a fight at the end, most of it was good enthusiastic support.

I'm buying my LAFC shirt this week. Love the design. Still wearing Hibs jersey at Derby games! :greengrin

[AZhibee]

The guy certainly backs up his mouth!

Evidently so!

[AZhibee]

I thought he was offside in the replay too.

Unreal contest and a great display by LAFC for a lot of it.

Ibrahimovic's first goal was amazing to watch and I had to celebrate it.

Great derby and good signs for football in LA. Although a couple of thugs tried to start a fight at the end, most of it was good enthusiastic support.

I'm buying my LAFC shirt this week. Love the design. Still wearing Hibs jersey at Derby games! :greengrin

Season Tickets to both, that's quite a bit football. I am curious to see LAFC, but Galaxy is more accessible (in-laws in OC). Hope to go once this year.

And if anyone noticed Phoenix Rising FC ran an ad right at the start of halftime; forget Detroit n Sacramento- Phoenix is rising.

[GreenLake]

Season Tickets to both, that's quite a bit football. I am curious to see LAFC, but Galaxy is more accessible (in-laws in OC). Hope to go once this year.

And if anyone noticed Phoenix Rising FC ran an ad right at the start of halftime; forget Detroit n Sacramento- Phoenix is rising.

The game I want to see this year is either LAFC or LA Galaxy against Atlanta. They broke 70,000 at a recent MLS game! Must be an amazing support.

[AZhibee]

Ok so it's FC Cincy in. Suspect or maybe just hope that the MLS will announce four new finalists for the last 2 spots inluding Phoenix (Sac, Detroit, Phx, ?).

[AZhibee]

Just sayin, but the Atlanta United sharp two tone field in 5 yard increments bugs me.