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View Full Version : European qualification - what's the script?



California-Hibs
10-03-2015, 07:42 AM
So there seems to be a lot of confusion in relation to us qualifying for the Europa League providing we get to the Cup Final.

In having a debate with a friend about it currently over Facebook snd I'm looking to get it cleared up.

I thought that if its a Hibs v Celtic final we'll automatically qualify, as they'll have finished In a European league spot in the Premier League?

If it's Dundee United/Inverness we play, and they finish outside the top 3 (it's 3 places the league gets right?) then we'd have to actually win the cup to qualify for the Europa league?

He's under the impression that the cup had its European place taken and given to the league now instead?

Can anyone clarify this once and for all?

Ronniekirk
10-03-2015, 07:56 AM
So there seems to be a lot of confusion in relation to us qualifying for the Europa League proving we get to the Cup Final.

In having a debate with a friend about it currently over Facebook snd I'm looking to get it cleared up.

I thought that if its a Hibs v Celtic final we'll automatically qualify, as they'll have finished In a European league spot in the Premier League?

If it's Dundee United/Inverness we play, and they finish outside the top 3 (it's 3 places the league gets right?) then we'd have to actually win the cup to qualify for the Europa league?

He's under the impression that the cup had its European place taken and given to the league now instead?

Can anyone clarify this once and for all?
Just googled it there am afraid rules were changed for this season and runners up don't get European spot its scottish cup winners and if Celtic win it and the Leauge it's the next three highest placed Leauge positions as only four teams qualify this year instead of five due to poor coefficient in recent years .No doubt Rangers will claim that's one of the negative impacts of not having them in the big Leauge

jgl07
10-03-2015, 07:59 AM
So there seems to be a lot of confusion in relation to us qualifying for the Europa League proving we get to the Cup Final.

In having a debate with a friend about it currently over Facebook snd I'm looking to get it cleared up.

I thought that if its a Hibs v Celtic final we'll automatically qualify, as they'll have finished In a European league spot in the Premier League?

If it's Dundee United/Inverness we play, and they finish outside the top 3 (it's 3 places the league gets right?) then we'd have to actually win the cup to qualify for the Europa league?

He's under the impression that the cup had its European place taken and given to the league now instead?

Can anyone clarify this once and for all?
Up till this season the domestic cup runners up would qualify for the Europa League if the Cup winners had qualified for the Champions League.

This rule has been changed for next season and in the event of Celtic winning the League and the Cup, the Europa League place will go to the team finishing fourth in the League.

Jim44
10-03-2015, 08:06 AM
Here's the wording:

Should the domestic cup winners qualify for the Champions League, the cup runners-up will no longer be granted a spot in the Europa League, and the spot will be given to the highest-placed team in the league which have not yet qualified for European competitions.[3]

Andy74
10-03-2015, 08:08 AM
I'm not so sure it actually has been changed yet despite what wiki might say.

Jim44
10-03-2015, 08:15 AM
I'm not so sure it actually has been changed yet despite what wiki might say.

The Wiki entry states: All information is subject to future confirmation by UEFA. Whether that's been done or will be done is anyone's guess but I would assume it will be ratified.

California-Hibs
10-03-2015, 08:37 AM
So if we win it we'll qualify and not otherwise?

GreenArmyyy!
10-03-2015, 09:16 AM
Looks like we will just need to win the thing then :)

Hiber-nation
10-03-2015, 10:05 AM
The Wiki entry states: All information is subject to future confirmation by UEFA. Whether that's been done or will be done is anyone's guess but I would assume it will be ratified.

Can't see it on UEFA.com but there's a letter to the various FAs last year from UEFA referenced at the foot of the Wiki page http://kassiesa.net/uefafiles/2015-18-uefa-access-list-explanations.pdf

TowerHibs
10-03-2015, 10:33 AM
I am not actually against this ever though it may go against us this year. Gretna and QOS being in Europe almost made it a mockery and in all honesty it's a complete waste of euro slot.

Yes chances are the 4/5th place team gets knocked out but it is less of a chance than a 1st division team

jgl07
10-03-2015, 10:37 AM
The Wiki entry states: All information is subject to future confirmation by UEFA. Whether that's been done or will be done is anyone's guess but I would assume it will be ratified.
UEFA have been very protective of the status of domestic cup winners in the past ever since the Cup Winners Cup was abolished.

Scotland have been trying for years to have the Cup Winners slot given to the highest placed non-qualifier in the League in the event that the Cup Winners makes the Champions' League. A string of teams outside the top flight have represented Scotland in Europe including Dunfermline, Queen of the South(?), Gretna, doing little for the national coefficient. Of course Raith Rovers qualified by winning the League Cup and did rather well.

I assume that all the pressure has brought a change in policy.

I am not convinced that Hibs or Falkirk would be any worse in Europe than say Inverness.

Keith_M
10-03-2015, 10:40 AM
I don't think the Cup Runners Up should qualify for Europe, even if that meant Hibs were to lose out.

I'd much rather see us qualify next season, on merit, with enough time to prepare.

Gavin1875
10-03-2015, 10:59 AM
I am not convinced that Hibs or Falkirk would be any worse in Europe than say Inverness.

Can't do any worse than last time

Mr White
10-03-2015, 12:24 PM
Unless you're equipped to compete in europe qualifying for the early rounds of the europa league can do more harm than good imo. Wrecks the pre season, can cost a fair bit to travel to some of the furthest away destinations and getting tanked by a superior team halfway through their season before you've even played a pre season friendly isn't exactly the best preparation as we know only too well.

Bristolhibby
10-03-2015, 04:03 PM
Let's win the bloody thing then!

J

EastCalderHibby
10-03-2015, 10:18 PM
Unless you're equipped to compete in europe qualifying for the early rounds of the europa league can do more harm than good imo. Wrecks the pre season, can cost a fair bit to travel to some of the furthest away destinations and getting tanked by a superior team halfway through their season before you've even played a pre season friendly isn't exactly the best preparation as we know only too well.

if we get to the final and get to the last play off game as it would need to be league extension to do this
if in europe too. would we even have a break between seasons think it might be a bit tight

IberianHibernian
10-03-2015, 10:49 PM
We were relegated in 1980 a year after marathon 3-match Scottish Cup final ( our season finished with a league game against Rangers at the end of May at a time when league season finished in April ) , again last year a year after a very late cup final and almost no close season and with other clubs there are other examples ( think St M and Dundee United were relegated the year after winning cup and Hearts after reaching final unexpectedly in 1976 ) . Long season and short close season means less rest ( physical and mental ) for players and less planning time . Lots of talk about summer football but really we should go back to a shorter season so players and fans get at least 2 months without public ( competitive or public friendlies ) matches .

California-Hibs
11-03-2015, 12:43 AM
if we get to the final and get to the last play off game as it would need to be league extension to do this
if in europe too. would we even have a break between seasons think it might be a bit tight

I don't wanna alarm you, but, you have Terry Butcher as your avaitor!!!

NAE NOOKIE
11-03-2015, 01:45 AM
IMO qualifying for Europe is the last thing we need. If we get promoted I want us to be fully concentrated on making sure we get a good start in the league. If we don't go up the next season will without doubt be one of the most important in the clubs history .... failure to go up after 2 seasons in the lower leagues would be an utter disaster.

Given that our season could possibly end at the start of June it will be more important to give the players a good rest than having to start pre season training just about straight away in order to play 2 meaningless games at the start of July ... meaningless because we would be very lucky to progress and could well have to play in the erse end of nowhere.

I think the fans would stick with us for a 2nd Championship campaign, but for a 3rd it would be 6,000 die hards, if we were lucky.

In fact, if by some miracle we did win the cup I would be happy for us to give up our European place to Dundee Utd or ICT. Though I'm sure that wouldn't be allowed :greengrin

EdinMike
11-03-2015, 02:35 AM
I don't want to sound like a Negative Nancy here, but do we really want European qualification ?! What will it actually bring !? A sterner pre-season test I guess, but we surely can't/don't have any hope of progressing in that tournament do we !?

I'de rather we don't qualify, focus on what matters really.

southern hibby
11-03-2015, 07:56 AM
I'm all for Europe. The money generated from this one game is enormous revenue for Hibs. If we do get through ( yes it is a big if ) we generate more revenue. Every little will help Stubbsy get a few players to sign or even allow us to resign the ones out of contract, that he would like to keep.

GGTTH.

tamig
11-03-2015, 08:43 AM
I'm all for Europe. The money generated from this one game is enormous revenue for Hibs. If we do get through ( yes it is a big if ) we generate more revenue. Every little will help Stubbsy get a few players to sign or even allow us to resign the ones out of contract, that he would like to keep.

GGTTH.
Is it though? How much was made from the Malmo fiasco?

jodjam
11-03-2015, 08:54 AM
I'm all for Europe. The money generated from this one game is enormous revenue for Hibs. If we do get through ( yes it is a big if ) we generate more revenue. Every little will help Stubbsy get a few players to sign or even allow us to resign the ones out of contract, that he would like to keep.

GGTTH.

St Johnstone have admitted in the past to losing money on their Euro games. Granted we have a bigger home crowd but it's not gonna make us pots of money.

EdinMike
11-03-2015, 09:43 AM
And wouldn't we have to go through two qualifying games (4 games in total) to make a group ?! Nah... Not for me in our current state.

Scouse Hibee
11-03-2015, 10:57 AM
Why are we even considering being runners up in the final? IF we get there just think of winning it.

NAE NOOKIE
11-03-2015, 10:59 AM
I'm all for Europe. The money generated from this one game is enormous revenue for Hibs. If we do get through ( yes it is a big if ) we generate more revenue. Every little will help Stubbsy get a few players to sign or even allow us to resign the ones out of contract, that he would like to keep.

GGTTH.

I love European football. But I doubt it would make us enough money to justify the down side of having to pretty well cancel the closed season.

Keith_M
11-03-2015, 11:08 AM
Is it though? How much was made from the Malmo fiasco?


The early rounds actually cost the clubs money, as mentioned by another poster.

I really think there's little to be gained in playing an early qualifier in July, against a Club that's probably in the middle of their season. I think it just mucks up preparation for the season proper, with little or nothing to show in the way of financial benefit.

Andy74
11-03-2015, 11:15 AM
Why bother trying to get into the top league and get into the top 3 or 4 then?

We should be aiming to play in Europe every season that we can. We haven't been ready in spme of the previous years but you can see the club having a bit more continuity now and we shouldn't be scrambling around looking for a team or playing one full of 19 year olds.

In any case, European games are all about the trip abroad. I'd be delighted if we qualified for Europe from this year.

JimBHibees
11-03-2015, 12:20 PM
The early rounds actually cost the clubs money, as mentioned by another poster.

I really think there's little to be gained in playing an early qualifier in July, against a Club that's probably in the middle of their season. I think it just mucks up preparation for the season proper, with little or nothing to show in the way of financial benefit.

Surely we couldnt have lost money against Malmo given the excellent crowd that was at the home game, albeit not many seen all of the 90 mins. :greengrin

percy veer
11-03-2015, 12:34 PM
I am not actually against this ever though it may go against us this year. Gretna and QOS being in Europe almost made it a mockery and in all honesty it's a complete waste of euro slot.

Yes chances are the 4/5th place team gets knocked out but it is less of a chance than a 1st division team



yeah cause getting beat 9-0 off malmo never made a mockery.

Alfred E Newman
11-03-2015, 12:35 PM
We have a semi final to get through before worrying about anything else.

StevieC
11-03-2015, 12:50 PM
I don't wanna alarm you, but, you have Terry Butcher as your avaitor!!!

Bloody hell, if his flying skills are anything like his managerial skills then ECH is in serious trouble!

Spike Mandela
11-03-2015, 01:20 PM
I want to win the Cup and get promoted but couldn't care less about Europe.

All it means these days is one or two ties when we are ill prepared and our squad is never fully complete. Pointless exercise.

scoopyboy
11-03-2015, 01:34 PM
The early rounds actually cost the clubs money, as mentioned by another poster.

I really think there's little to be gained in playing an early qualifier in July, against a Club that's probably in the middle of their season. I think it just mucks up preparation for the season proper, with little or nothing to show in the way of financial benefit.

Nonsense.

Hibs scored financially out of the Malmo tie.

St.Johnstone lost out financially one time cos they had an expensive charter flight to their away leg and got a paltry amount of fans through the turnstiles for the return leg.

lucky
11-03-2015, 01:39 PM
I want European qualification as it means a trip away. Anyone who has ever been would want another.

Dashing Bob S
11-03-2015, 01:39 PM
Would like to see The Rangers given an automatic European spot - purely on the basis of tradition.

JimBHibees
11-03-2015, 01:42 PM
Nonsense.

Hibs scored financially out of the Malmo tie.

St.Johnstone lost out financially one time cos they had an expensive charter flight to their away leg and got a paltry amount of fans through the turnstiles for the return leg.

Agree you only really will lose out if playing a team in Kazakhstan or whatever and need either a charter flight or two or three connections. If playing a team with easy access and relatively attractive think you would earn money most times if getting a decent home gate.

Andy74
11-03-2015, 01:42 PM
I want European qualification as it means a trip away. Anyone who has ever been would want another.

Indeed. Until you get landed in a pub in Malmo talking to some boy about trade unions. :greengrin

StevieC
11-03-2015, 02:08 PM
Indeed. Until you get landed in a pub in Malmo talking to some boy about trade unions. :greengrin

Think yourself lucky it was just the pub, some of us had to listen to it all the way to/from London on the train as well as on the flights.

southern hibby
11-03-2015, 02:43 PM
Is it though? How much was made from the Malmo fiasco?

Not exactly sure. However10,000 fans ( at home ) paying £20 a pop, refuse to believe that any ground in Europe would cost Hibs money to get to and not have substantial profit at the end.

GGTTH

lucky
11-03-2015, 03:48 PM
Think yourself lucky it was just the pub, some of us had to listen to it all the way to/from London on the train as well as on the flights.

Don't recall you complaining but if you travel with 3 union men you are guaranteed Union talk and beer.

But must admit I don't recall talking to Andy